Novi korona virus - velika opasnost ili ne ? POGLEDATI PRVI POST!

[daddy-kool]

Masovno testiranje, traženje kontakata i izolacija funkcionišu.

[daddy-kool]

https://www.dn.se/sthlm/kostnaden-for-s ... v-miljard/

(prevod sa reddita)

The cost of Stockholm's corona tests is already up to half a billion

More than 550,000 Stockholmers have now been tested for the coronavirus and the cost has already exceeded half a billion. Statistics show that as many as 16 percent have antibodies to the virus.

- We are in a completely different league than most cities in the world, both in number of tests and number of positives, says Claes Ruth, function manager at Karolinska University Laboratory.

A steady stream of cars rolls in towards the drive-in test station at Karolinska in Solna. Visitors with suspected covid-19 must not get out of the car. The test kit is delivered through folded boxes for self-sampling.

- We receive about a hundred patients a day, the tests for ongoing Covid-19 are about as many as in July. But the antibody tests taken at the hospital have decreased dramatically, from up to 800 a day to now a maximum of 200, says Zeynab Salad, a medical student who distributes samples.

The drive-in station in Solna is one of nine spread across the county, most of which are located at hospitals and Lidl stores.

- Not all traders want test stations, they are afraid that the infection will spread, even some municipalities have been difficult. For us, it has been important to be spread everywhere to avoid the risk of not reaching all target groups, therefore the information is available in many languages, says Claes Ruth, function manager at Karolinska University Laboratory.

The Stockholm region was out in mid-June to offer free tests to everyone and antibody tests are available in about 80 places. Most people choose to have the self-test for covid-19 (PCR test) sent home and picked up by taxi. The total cost of the samples during the first ten weeks is already just over half a billion kronor and is reimbursed by the state. A PCR test is reimburced with SEK 1,400 and an antibody test with SEK 750.

- All costs, including taxis, are covered by the standard. We do not want the sick to use public transport, therefore we send the tests home, or want you to take your own car to the drive-in stations, says Claes Ruth.

The region wants as many people as possible with cold symptoms to get tested. Today, there is only the restriction that a person may not take more than two tests during a three-week period. The region would already now want information from the government about the compensation after New Year, so you know what to rig for.

- It is extremely difficult to predict how many will want to test themselves depending on how the pandemic develops, some may need to take a test again this fall. We have an obligation to make it possible and so far we have succeeded. We have the capacity for greater demand than now, says Claes Ruth.

Since mid-June , more than 550,000 people in the Stockholm region have been tested for both antibodies and ongoing covid-19 infection according to statistics requested by DN. The results show that 16.1 percent have antibodies, which is among the highest in the world.

- Antibody levels of up to fifteen percent have been seen in New York, and in Madrid and the surrounding area, as well as in some parts of northern Italy. But in Denmark and Norway, for example, it is only a few percent, says Jan Albert, professor of microbiology and infection control at Karolinska Institutet.

However, the high proportion of positives out of just over 400,000 tested does not mean that Stockholm has achieved herd immunity.

- No, no one really knows what proportion of positive antibody tests are required to reduce the spread of infection due to immunity. First they said 60 percent, then came calculations around 43 percent. There is also great uncertainty about how T-cell immunity can affect, says Jan Albert.

How long the immunity of people with antibodies lasts is also unclear.

- It is different for different infections how strong the protection becomes and also differs from person to person. The Swedish Public Health Agency has said six months, it is reasonable to believe that it will last at least that long, but it will certainly vary, says Jan Albert.

He believes that the great value of broad antibody testing is that residents with a little more security can spend time with parents and older people and go to work if you have antibodies and that it also provides knowledge about the virus situation in the Stockholm region.

- But when it comes to preventing and breaking chains of infection, it is the PCR tests for ongoing infection that are relevant. The Stockholm region has now decided to also trace people who have tested positive for infection, which I think is good, says Jan Albert.

The statistics show that 6.6 percent of the approximately 144,000 Stockholmers who tested themselves for ongoing covid-19 infection were positive when they tested themselves. It is also high internationally. More women than men have tested themselves, especially among the elderly, despite the fact that men are harder hit by the virus. One of the reasons is believed to be that the care occupational groups that were previously prioritized are dominated by women.

The proportion of positive PCR tests has decreased in recent weeks, which is in line with the reduction in both care pressure and the number of deaths. What happens next is difficult to know.

- Even though there are several hundred thousand tests, it is not a random selection of Stockholmers, therefore it can change over time. Those who had the most suspicion of infection may have tested themselves early. Therefore, it is very difficult to draw hard conclusions from the changes, says Jan Albert.

How reliable is it that people test themselves?

- PCR tests are very sensitive and reliable when performed by quality-assured laboratories. But one of the biggest risks of not catching an infection is that you fail to take the sample and it is a greater risk if you do it yourself, says Jan Albert.

This week came the information that 1,875 tests for ongoing covid-19 in the Stockholm region showed incorrectly positive answers . But there is nothing that affects the willingness to test at the drive-in station outside Karolinska in Solna where lunch rush is taking place.

- I have full confidence in these tests. And I'm not worried about the development. The tragedy in this context is that Sweden chose its own path which now still turns out to be that we may not get a second wave as out in Europe where it has been shut down completely. It seems that we have absorbed the virus in society in some way, no matter how awful it sounds, says Johan Nyrén who is waiting his turn.

His seven-year-old daughter Ingrid came home with a sore throat and cough on the first day of school and will now be tested. She struggles hard to get the test strip all the way into the throat without nausea, in the end the parents manage to take the test under the tongue, an alternative used on children.

- We think it might be a common sore throat, but we went here for safety to test. We have had covid-19, both me and my wife, we did antibody tests in June. I had common flu symptoms, but my wife was worse. She was in hospital for a turn with breathing difficulties, but managed, says Johan Nyrén.

He leaves the sealed test tube in a bag for Zeynab Salad, which sends it to the lab for analysis within 48 hours. She has had a stressful time during the shift but enjoys her extra job.

- It feels good to work here. At first I was scared and worried about getting infected, but now I just feel that I am doing society a favor, says Zeynab Salad.

Stvarno je bilo misteriozno zašto je broj novoinficiranih u Švedskoj onako naglo pao, ali evo razlozi izlaze na vidjelo. Kao što se i od početka govorilo: masovno testiranje, traženje kontakata i izolacija funkcionišu i daju rezultate. Šveđani su prilično tiho primjenili ove principe i nakon dvije sedmice od početka masovnog testiranja dolazi do dramatičnog pada novozaraženih, a usput su skontali da treba tražiti i kontakte i prilagodili su svoj pristup tome. Ovo je strategija koja funkcioniše, ne ona pusti pa šta bude. Samo što ovaj pristup nisu razglasili na sva zvona, nego pričaju bajke o nekakvom desegnutom kolektivnom imunitetu.

[biglebovski]

Stvarno je bilo misteriozno zašto je broj novoinficiranih u Švedskoj onako naglo pao, ali evo razlozi izlaze na vidjelo. Kao što se i od početka govorilo: masovno testiranje, traženje kontakata i izolacija u slučaju zaraze funkcionišu i daju rezultate.

A možda je i ovo razlog zašto je broj pao:

"It seems that we have absorbed the virus in society in some way" ili
Izgleda da smo na neki način apsorbirali virus u društvu

[daddy-kool]

Stvarno je bilo misteriozno zašto je broj novoinficiranih u Švedskoj onako naglo pao, ali evo razlozi izlaze na vidjelo. Kao što se i od početka govorilo: masovno testiranje, traženje kontakata i izolacija u slučaju zaraze funkcionišu i daju rezultate.

A možda je i ovo razlog zašto je broj pao:

"It seems that we have absorbed the virus in society in some way" ili
Izgleda da smo na neki način apsorbirali virus u društvu

Kao što rekoh bajke.
Da nisu primjenili TTI od sredine juna mogli bi i pričati o tome, ovako ne.

[Tambure]

Who da malo procita ovu temu virus bi bio nokautoran sto je reci juce. Sve moj do mojega

[zemomak]

@zemomak znas li sta je pravo na privatnost? Da li si cuo za GDPR? I kako covjek na respiratoru da da pristanak da ga snimaju?

naravno da jesam...a jesi ti cula za onog doktora iz italije sto su ga makli sa youtube?

Kako covjek na respiratoru moze dati pristanak za snimanje?
A za doktora sam postavila par logicnih pitanja.
Kako ako cemo svi biti "lazno pozitivni" sto tvrdi u prvom dijelu ce neko vrsiti vakcinaciju? Ne vakcinisu se ljudi koji su prebolovali bolest. To je elementarna logika!

to nije vakcina, to je pasoš...

[daddy-kool]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... est-london
Coronavirus sceptics, conspiracy theorists and anti-vaxxers protest in London

[konektovan]

Stvarno je bilo misteriozno zašto je broj novoinficiranih u Švedskoj onako naglo pao, ali evo razlozi izlaze na vidjelo. Kao što se i od početka govorilo: masovno testiranje, traženje kontakata i izolacija u slučaju zaraze funkcionišu i daju rezultate.

A možda je i ovo razlog zašto je broj pao:

"It seems that we have absorbed the virus in society in some way" ili
Izgleda da smo na neki način apsorbirali virus u društvu

Kao što rekoh bajke.
Da nisu primjenili TTI od sredine juna mogli bi i pričati o tome, ovako ne.

Ta će švecka, njihova nauka, medEcina, pu pu, tebali su tebi racune polagati šta i kako.

[daddy-kool]

Ta će švecka, njihova nauka, medEcina, pu pu, tebali su tebi racune polagati šta i kako.

Od kako su primjenili nauku i dokazano uspješnu strategiju, imali su uspjeha u smanjenju broja novoinficiranih.
Meni svakako niko neće polagati račune, ali se ljudi još uvijek kače za "švedski model" (raspašoj), a on se u Švedskoj završio sredinom juna. Od tada Šveđani furaju TTI i imaju uspjeha.

edit: kao što sam gore napisao i Srbija je istom strategijom uspješno smanjila brojeve novoinficiranih.

[daddy-kool]

https://theconversation.com/declining-a ... rry-143323

When antibody levels fall, does immunity disappear?
In general, the answer is no. If the virus attempts to cause a second infection, the memory B and T cells are able to recognize it, multiply million of times and defend the body against the virus, preventing it from triggering another full-blown infection.

The protection provided by memory T and B cells is the reason that vaccine-based protection works.

However, there are exceptions. A lifelong vaccine against the flu does not work because flu’s genetic code changes rapidly, altering the appearance of the flu, and therefore requires a new vaccine every season.

But with SARS-CoV-2, the problem as I see it, seems to be that those memory T cells and B cells seem to be wiped out.

Antibodies are proteins and last for only between three and four weeks in the blood circulation. To keep antibody levels high, B cells need to replenish them with a fresh supply. But in COVID-19, the declining antibody levels suggest that the cells that produce these antibodies are not present in sufficient numbers, which would explain the drop in antibody levels. Studies of how long immunity from COVID-19 last may shed more light, but for now we do not know the reason why.

[biglebovski]

The Stockholm region has now decided to also trace people who have tested positive for infection,

Kao što rekoh bajke.
Da nisu primjenili TTI od sredine juna mogli bi i pričati o tome, ovako ne.

O kakvim bajkama i TTI je riječ kad fino u članku čovjek kaže da se ovo odnosi na širi Stokholm (Švedska nije grad-država) i da trebaju tek da krenu sa praćenjem, članak 20.08. napisan.
Jasno mi je da velikim zagovornicima lockdown-a teško pada argumentacija protiv istog, al eto, imamo već i neke "priznate" stručnjake koji govore da je isti čisti promašaj.

[mO k3]

Sta je sa Afrikom , tu nema nikakvih podataka ??

[kox]

https://www.dn.se/sthlm/kostnaden-for-s ... v-miljard/

(prevod sa reddita)

The cost of Stockholm's corona tests is already up to half a billion

More than 550,000 Stockholmers have now been tested for the coronavirus and the cost has already exceeded half a billion. Statistics show that as many as 16 percent have antibodies to the virus.

- We are in a completely different league than most cities in the world, both in number of tests and number of positives, says Claes Ruth, function manager at Karolinska University Laboratory.

A steady stream of cars rolls in towards the drive-in test station at Karolinska in Solna. Visitors with suspected covid-19 must not get out of the car. The test kit is delivered through folded boxes for self-sampling.

- We receive about a hundred patients a day, the tests for ongoing Covid-19 are about as many as in July. But the antibody tests taken at the hospital have decreased dramatically, from up to 800 a day to now a maximum of 200, says Zeynab Salad, a medical student who distributes samples.

The drive-in station in Solna is one of nine spread across the county, most of which are located at hospitals and Lidl stores.

- Not all traders want test stations, they are afraid that the infection will spread, even some municipalities have been difficult. For us, it has been important to be spread everywhere to avoid the risk of not reaching all target groups, therefore the information is available in many languages, says Claes Ruth, function manager at Karolinska University Laboratory.

The Stockholm region was out in mid-June to offer free tests to everyone and antibody tests are available in about 80 places. Most people choose to have the self-test for covid-19 (PCR test) sent home and picked up by taxi. The total cost of the samples during the first ten weeks is already just over half a billion kronor and is reimbursed by the state. A PCR test is reimburced with SEK 1,400 and an antibody test with SEK 750.

- All costs, including taxis, are covered by the standard. We do not want the sick to use public transport, therefore we send the tests home, or want you to take your own car to the drive-in stations, says Claes Ruth.

The region wants as many people as possible with cold symptoms to get tested. Today, there is only the restriction that a person may not take more than two tests during a three-week period. The region would already now want information from the government about the compensation after New Year, so you know what to rig for.

- It is extremely difficult to predict how many will want to test themselves depending on how the pandemic develops, some may need to take a test again this fall. We have an obligation to make it possible and so far we have succeeded. We have the capacity for greater demand than now, says Claes Ruth.

Since mid-June , more than 550,000 people in the Stockholm region have been tested for both antibodies and ongoing covid-19 infection according to statistics requested by DN. The results show that 16.1 percent have antibodies, which is among the highest in the world.

- Antibody levels of up to fifteen percent have been seen in New York, and in Madrid and the surrounding area, as well as in some parts of northern Italy. But in Denmark and Norway, for example, it is only a few percent, says Jan Albert, professor of microbiology and infection control at Karolinska Institutet.

However, the high proportion of positives out of just over 400,000 tested does not mean that Stockholm has achieved herd immunity.

- No, no one really knows what proportion of positive antibody tests are required to reduce the spread of infection due to immunity. First they said 60 percent, then came calculations around 43 percent. There is also great uncertainty about how T-cell immunity can affect, says Jan Albert.

How long the immunity of people with antibodies lasts is also unclear.

- It is different for different infections how strong the protection becomes and also differs from person to person. The Swedish Public Health Agency has said six months, it is reasonable to believe that it will last at least that long, but it will certainly vary, says Jan Albert.

He believes that the great value of broad antibody testing is that residents with a little more security can spend time with parents and older people and go to work if you have antibodies and that it also provides knowledge about the virus situation in the Stockholm region.

- But when it comes to preventing and breaking chains of infection, it is the PCR tests for ongoing infection that are relevant. The Stockholm region has now decided to also trace people who have tested positive for infection, which I think is good, says Jan Albert.

The statistics show that 6.6 percent of the approximately 144,000 Stockholmers who tested themselves for ongoing covid-19 infection were positive when they tested themselves. It is also high internationally. More women than men have tested themselves, especially among the elderly, despite the fact that men are harder hit by the virus. One of the reasons is believed to be that the care occupational groups that were previously prioritized are dominated by women.

The proportion of positive PCR tests has decreased in recent weeks, which is in line with the reduction in both care pressure and the number of deaths. What happens next is difficult to know.

- Even though there are several hundred thousand tests, it is not a random selection of Stockholmers, therefore it can change over time. Those who had the most suspicion of infection may have tested themselves early. Therefore, it is very difficult to draw hard conclusions from the changes, says Jan Albert.

How reliable is it that people test themselves?

- PCR tests are very sensitive and reliable when performed by quality-assured laboratories. But one of the biggest risks of not catching an infection is that you fail to take the sample and it is a greater risk if you do it yourself, says Jan Albert.

This week came the information that 1,875 tests for ongoing covid-19 in the Stockholm region showed incorrectly positive answers . But there is nothing that affects the willingness to test at the drive-in station outside Karolinska in Solna where lunch rush is taking place.

- I have full confidence in these tests. And I'm not worried about the development. The tragedy in this context is that Sweden chose its own path which now still turns out to be that we may not get a second wave as out in Europe where it has been shut down completely. It seems that we have absorbed the virus in society in some way, no matter how awful it sounds, says Johan Nyrén who is waiting his turn.

His seven-year-old daughter Ingrid came home with a sore throat and cough on the first day of school and will now be tested. She struggles hard to get the test strip all the way into the throat without nausea, in the end the parents manage to take the test under the tongue, an alternative used on children.

- We think it might be a common sore throat, but we went here for safety to test. We have had covid-19, both me and my wife, we did antibody tests in June. I had common flu symptoms, but my wife was worse. She was in hospital for a turn with breathing difficulties, but managed, says Johan Nyrén.

He leaves the sealed test tube in a bag for Zeynab Salad, which sends it to the lab for analysis within 48 hours. She has had a stressful time during the shift but enjoys her extra job.

- It feels good to work here. At first I was scared and worried about getting infected, but now I just feel that I am doing society a favor, says Zeynab Salad.

Stvarno je bilo misteriozno zašto je broj novoinficiranih u Švedskoj onako naglo pao, ali evo razlozi izlaze na vidjelo. Kao što se i od početka govorilo: masovno testiranje, traženje kontakata i izolacija funkcionišu i daju rezultate. Šveđani su prilično tiho primjenili ove principe i nakon dvije sedmice od početka masovnog testiranja dolazi do dramatičnog pada novozaraženih, a usput su skontali da treba tražiti i kontakte i prilagodili su svoj pristup tome. Ovo je strategija koja funkcioniše, ne ona pusti pa šta bude. Samo što ovaj pristup nisu razglasili na sva zvona, nego pričaju bajke o nekakvom desegnutom kolektivnom imunitetu.

Kòliko vidim ovdje uopšte ne spominju traženje kontakata.
Ljudi se testiraju dobrovoljno ukoliko misle da imaju simptome i država je odlučila da one čiji su rezultati pozitivni prati , dakle vjerovatno da ih evidentira u sistemu.
Mozda nisam upratio, gdje se spominju kontakti i njihovo testiranje ili izolacija ?

[zemomak]

https://www.dn.se/sthlm/kostnaden-for-s ... v-miljard/

(prevod sa reddita)

The cost of Stockholm's corona tests is already up to half a billion

More than 550,000 Stockholmers have now been tested for the coronavirus and the cost has already exceeded half a billion. Statistics show that as many as 16 percent have antibodies to the virus.

- We are in a completely different league than most cities in the world, both in number of tests and number of positives, says Claes Ruth, function manager at Karolinska University Laboratory.

A steady stream of cars rolls in towards the drive-in test station at Karolinska in Solna. Visitors with suspected covid-19 must not get out of the car. The test kit is delivered through folded boxes for self-sampling.

- We receive about a hundred patients a day, the tests for ongoing Covid-19 are about as many as in July. But the antibody tests taken at the hospital have decreased dramatically, from up to 800 a day to now a maximum of 200, says Zeynab Salad, a medical student who distributes samples.

The drive-in station in Solna is one of nine spread across the county, most of which are located at hospitals and Lidl stores.

- Not all traders want test stations, they are afraid that the infection will spread, even some municipalities have been difficult. For us, it has been important to be spread everywhere to avoid the risk of not reaching all target groups, therefore the information is available in many languages, says Claes Ruth, function manager at Karolinska University Laboratory.

The Stockholm region was out in mid-June to offer free tests to everyone and antibody tests are available in about 80 places. Most people choose to have the self-test for covid-19 (PCR test) sent home and picked up by taxi. The total cost of the samples during the first ten weeks is already just over half a billion kronor and is reimbursed by the state. A PCR test is reimburced with SEK 1,400 and an antibody test with SEK 750.

- All costs, including taxis, are covered by the standard. We do not want the sick to use public transport, therefore we send the tests home, or want you to take your own car to the drive-in stations, says Claes Ruth.

The region wants as many people as possible with cold symptoms to get tested. Today, there is only the restriction that a person may not take more than two tests during a three-week period. The region would already now want information from the government about the compensation after New Year, so you know what to rig for.

- It is extremely difficult to predict how many will want to test themselves depending on how the pandemic develops, some may need to take a test again this fall. We have an obligation to make it possible and so far we have succeeded. We have the capacity for greater demand than now, says Claes Ruth.

Since mid-June , more than 550,000 people in the Stockholm region have been tested for both antibodies and ongoing covid-19 infection according to statistics requested by DN. The results show that 16.1 percent have antibodies, which is among the highest in the world.

- Antibody levels of up to fifteen percent have been seen in New York, and in Madrid and the surrounding area, as well as in some parts of northern Italy. But in Denmark and Norway, for example, it is only a few percent, says Jan Albert, professor of microbiology and infection control at Karolinska Institutet.

However, the high proportion of positives out of just over 400,000 tested does not mean that Stockholm has achieved herd immunity.

- No, no one really knows what proportion of positive antibody tests are required to reduce the spread of infection due to immunity. First they said 60 percent, then came calculations around 43 percent. There is also great uncertainty about how T-cell immunity can affect, says Jan Albert.

How long the immunity of people with antibodies lasts is also unclear.

- It is different for different infections how strong the protection becomes and also differs from person to person. The Swedish Public Health Agency has said six months, it is reasonable to believe that it will last at least that long, but it will certainly vary, says Jan Albert.

He believes that the great value of broad antibody testing is that residents with a little more security can spend time with parents and older people and go to work if you have antibodies and that it also provides knowledge about the virus situation in the Stockholm region.

- But when it comes to preventing and breaking chains of infection, it is the PCR tests for ongoing infection that are relevant. The Stockholm region has now decided to also trace people who have tested positive for infection, which I think is good, says Jan Albert.

The statistics show that 6.6 percent of the approximately 144,000 Stockholmers who tested themselves for ongoing covid-19 infection were positive when they tested themselves. It is also high internationally. More women than men have tested themselves, especially among the elderly, despite the fact that men are harder hit by the virus. One of the reasons is believed to be that the care occupational groups that were previously prioritized are dominated by women.

The proportion of positive PCR tests has decreased in recent weeks, which is in line with the reduction in both care pressure and the number of deaths. What happens next is difficult to know.

- Even though there are several hundred thousand tests, it is not a random selection of Stockholmers, therefore it can change over time. Those who had the most suspicion of infection may have tested themselves early. Therefore, it is very difficult to draw hard conclusions from the changes, says Jan Albert.

How reliable is it that people test themselves?

- PCR tests are very sensitive and reliable when performed by quality-assured laboratories. But one of the biggest risks of not catching an infection is that you fail to take the sample and it is a greater risk if you do it yourself, says Jan Albert.

This week came the information that 1,875 tests for ongoing covid-19 in the Stockholm region showed incorrectly positive answers . But there is nothing that affects the willingness to test at the drive-in station outside Karolinska in Solna where lunch rush is taking place.

- I have full confidence in these tests. And I'm not worried about the development. The tragedy in this context is that Sweden chose its own path which now still turns out to be that we may not get a second wave as out in Europe where it has been shut down completely. It seems that we have absorbed the virus in society in some way, no matter how awful it sounds, says Johan Nyrén who is waiting his turn.

His seven-year-old daughter Ingrid came home with a sore throat and cough on the first day of school and will now be tested. She struggles hard to get the test strip all the way into the throat without nausea, in the end the parents manage to take the test under the tongue, an alternative used on children.

- We think it might be a common sore throat, but we went here for safety to test. We have had covid-19, both me and my wife, we did antibody tests in June. I had common flu symptoms, but my wife was worse. She was in hospital for a turn with breathing difficulties, but managed, says Johan Nyrén.

He leaves the sealed test tube in a bag for Zeynab Salad, which sends it to the lab for analysis within 48 hours. She has had a stressful time during the shift but enjoys her extra job.

- It feels good to work here. At first I was scared and worried about getting infected, but now I just feel that I am doing society a favor, says Zeynab Salad.

Stvarno je bilo misteriozno zašto je broj novoinficiranih u Švedskoj onako naglo pao, ali evo razlozi izlaze na vidjelo. Kao što se i od početka govorilo: masovno testiranje, traženje kontakata i izolacija funkcionišu i daju rezultate. Šveđani su prilično tiho primjenili ove principe i nakon dvije sedmice od početka masovnog testiranja dolazi do dramatičnog pada novozaraženih, a usput su skontali da treba tražiti i kontakte i prilagodili su svoj pristup tome. Ovo je strategija koja funkcioniše, ne ona pusti pa šta bude. Samo što ovaj pristup nisu razglasili na sva zvona, nego pričaju bajke o nekakvom desegnutom kolektivnom imunitetu.

Kòliko vidim ovdje uopšte ne spominju traženje kontakata.
Ljudi se testiraju dobrovoljno ukoliko misle da imaju simptome i država je odlučila da one čiji su rezultati pozitivni prati , dakle vjerovatno da ih evidentira u sistemu.
Mozda nisam upratio, gdje se spominju kontakti i njihovo testiranje ili izolacija ?

vidis da gura agendu TTTTTTTTTT (testirat kineskim testovima) kako njemu pashe, nema lik pojma...laze

[kox]

Stvarno je bilo misteriozno zašto je broj novoinficiranih u Švedskoj onako naglo pao, ali evo razlozi izlaze na vidjelo. Kao što se i od početka govorilo: masovno testiranje, traženje kontakata i izolacija funkcionišu i daju rezultate. Šveđani su prilično tiho primjenili ove principe i nakon dvije sedmice od početka masovnog testiranja dolazi do dramatičnog pada novozaraženih, a usput su skontali da treba tražiti i kontakte i prilagodili su svoj pristup tome. Ovo je strategija koja funkcioniše, ne ona pusti pa šta bude. Samo što ovaj pristup nisu razglasili na sva zvona, nego pričaju bajke o nekakvom desegnutom kolektivnom imunitetu.

Kòliko vidim ovdje uopšte ne spominju traženje kontakata.
Ljudi se testiraju dobrovoljno ukoliko misle da imaju simptome i država je odlučila da one čiji su rezultati pozitivni prati , dakle vjerovatno da ih evidentira u sistemu.
Mozda nisam upratio, gdje se spominju kontakti i njihovo testiranje ili izolacija ?

vidis da gura agendu TTTTTTTTTT (testirat kineskim testovima) kako njemu pashe, nema lik pojma...laze

Koliko mi je poznato Svedi dosta testiraju, prema njihovim smjernicama i kontakti se obavještavaju i preporučeno je da se testiraju, ali u postavljenom clanku to koliko vidim ne pise (ovaj dio o kontaktima)

[daddy-kool]

Kòliko vidim ovdje uopšte ne spominju traženje kontakata.
Ljudi se testiraju dobrovoljno ukoliko misle da imaju simptome i država je odlučila da one čiji su rezultati pozitivni prati , dakle vjerovatno da ih evidentira u sistemu.
Mozda nisam upratio, gdje se spominju kontakti i njihovo testiranje ili izolacija ?

Boldovano je bilo , ako sam dobro razumio prevod, nisao našao arhiviran članak na originalnom švedskom.

- But when it comes to preventing and breaking chains of infection, it is the PCR tests for ongoing infection that are relevant. The Stockholm region has now decided to also trace people who have tested positive for infection, which I think is good, says Jan Albert.

[daddy-kool]

The Stockholm region has now decided to also trace people who have tested positive for infection,

Kao što rekoh bajke.
Da nisu primjenili TTI od sredine juna mogli bi i pričati o tome, ovako ne.

O kakvim bajkama i TTI je riječ kad fino u članku čovjek kaže da se ovo odnosi na širi Stokholm (Švedska nije grad-država) i da trebaju tek da krenu sa praćenjem, članak 20.08. napisan.
Jasno mi je da velikim zagovornicima lockdown-a teško pada argumentacija protiv istog, al eto, imamo već i neke "priznate" stručnjake koji govore da je isti čisti promašaj.

Ovo je prilog o Stockholmu, ali se slično testira u čitavoj Švedskoj. Za 2,5 mjeseca potrošili su 50 miliona eura na testiranje u kantonu Stockholma.

[Ironmen]

Evo covjek kaze da je zvao 50 puta i niko mu se ne javlja na telefon, i sve je ok i normalno ??

Meni to nije normalno i onda kazu kako si doso do 70% pausalno sta vec...

[kox]

Kòliko vidim ovdje uopšte ne spominju traženje kontakata.
Ljudi se testiraju dobrovoljno ukoliko misle da imaju simptome i država je odlučila da one čiji su rezultati pozitivni prati , dakle vjerovatno da ih evidentira u sistemu.
Mozda nisam upratio, gdje se spominju kontakti i njihovo testiranje ili izolacija ?

Boldovano je bilo , ako sam dobro razumio prevod, nisao našao arhiviran članak na originalnom švedskom.

- But when it comes to preventing and breaking chains of infection, it is the PCR tests for ongoing infection that are relevant. The Stockholm region has now decided to also trace people who have tested positive for infection, which I think is good, says Jan Albert.

Koliko razumijem oni prate zaražene jer je članak o velikom broju dobrovoljnih testiranja. Dakle kad se dobrovoljno testiraju i rezultat im je pozitivan država ih unese u sistem. Oni od početka preporučuju dobrovoljno testiranje kontakata kada ih zarazeni sa kojim su bili u kontaktu obavijesti da je pozitivan, ali mislim da nije obavezno.

[Bluemore]

objavio Prof. Streeck na svom profilu i kaze naslov mu je malo suspektan ali je stoji iza teksta!!

ko zeli google translate bujrum


https://www.fuldaerzeitung.de/fulda/cor ... 33150.html



Hendrik Streeck wünscht sich eine Corona-Feuerwehr.
+
Hendrik Streeck, Direktor des Institut für Virologie an der Uniklinik in Bonn, wünscht sich eine Corona-Feuerwehr.
© Federico Gambarini / dpa

30.08.202020:32

Leiter der Heinsberg-Studie
Bonner Virologe Hendrik Streeck wünscht sich eine Corona-Feuerwehr

Daniela PetersenvonDaniela Petersen

Professor Dr. Hendrik Streeck ist einer der Virologen, der in der Corona-Pandemie zu Pragmatismus rät. Er leitet die Heinsberg-Studie und untersucht dabei die Immunität der Menschen im ersten Corona-Hotspot Deutschlands. Im Interview mit unserer Zeitung erklärt der 43-Jährige, wie er die steigenden Infektionszahlen bewertet und wie die Chancen auf einen Impfstoff stehen.

Im Interview mit der Fuldaer Zeitung plädiert Professor Dr. Hendrik Streeck dafür, sich in der Corona-Krise nicht nur an Infektionszahlen zu orientieren.
Der Leiter der Heinsberg-Studie ist außerdem für die Gründung einer Spezialgruppe, einer Art „Corona-Feuerwehr“ die bei Hotspots zum Einsatz kommt.
Das überraschendste für den Virologen im Umgang mit dem Virus: „Dass die Übertragung durch Aerosole in geschlossenen Räumen so eine bedeutende Rolle spielt“

Name Hendrik Streeck
Alter 43
Geburtsdatum 7. August 1977
Geburtsort Göttingen
Beruf Mediziner und Direktor des Institutes für Virologie an der Universität Bonn
Der Komiker Oliver Welke bezeichnete Virologen als „unsere neuen Popstars“. Auch bei Illner, Lanz und Maischberger ist Ihre Expertise gefragt. Ist Ihnen diese Popularität unheimlich?
Das kam tatsächlich überraschend, unheimlich ist es mir aber nicht. Mein primäres Ziel ist es aufzuklären. Denn, ich habe festgestellt, wie unterschiedlich Sichtweisen sind.
Wie ist Ihre Sichtweise?
Mir geht es um pragmatische Lösungsansätze. Ich möchte helfen, eine neue Normalität zu erreichen, indem wir weg von einer Verbots- hin zu einer Gebotskultur kommen.
Aber wir hören täglich von steigenden Infektionszahlen. Auch wenn die Zahl der Krankenhaus- und Sterbefälle zurückgeht, ist die Politik alarmiert.
Es gab verschiedene Phasen. Anfangs kannten wir das Virus nicht. Es war eine Gefahr da, und in meinen Augen hat die Bundesregierung in dieser Situation gut und folgerichtig gehandelt. Aus einer Gefahr ist aber nun ein Risiko geworden. Ein ernstzunehmendes Risiko, aber eines, das statistisch gesehen für den Einzelnen recht gering ist. Wenn wir nicht mehr nur auf die Infektionszahlen schauen, sondern auch stationäre und intensivmedizinische Belegungen in unsere Betrachtung mit einbeziehen, können wir das Risiko sehr viel besser einschätzen.
Ist der Kurs der Politik, sich auf die Infektionszahlen zu fokussieren, also falsch?
Symptomlose Infektionen haben im Allgemeinen für den Einzelnen keine negativen Folgen. Worum es in dieser Pandemie vor allem geht, sind Menschen, die schwer erkrankt sind und entweder stationär oder sogar intensivmedizinisch behandelt werden müssen. Ich plädiere für eine Ampel, die sich nicht nur an den Infektionszahlen, sondern auch an den mit Coronapatienten belegten stationären Betten orientiert.
Wie soll eine solche Ampel funktionieren?
Wenn wir neben den Infektionszahlen, die wir natürlich weiter beobachten müssen, im stationären Bereich bestimmte Schwellenwerte erreichen, springt die Ampel auf gelb oder rot. Das wiederum zieht bestimmte Maßnahmen nach sich. Wir haben fast 30.000 Intensivbetten, bei 10.000 belegten Betten könnte die Ampel auf Gelb, bei 20.000 auf Rot springen. Natürlich kann man diese Schwellenwerte nicht so vereinfacht bestimmen, aber wir haben viele Daten in den letzten acht Monaten gesammelt anhand derer wir gute Richtlinien erstellen können. Für mich wäre diese Ampel im Moment im grünen Bereich – auch wenn die Infektionszahlen zur Zeit steigen.

Lesen Sie hier: Professor Karina Reiß und Professor Sucharit Bhakdi verteidigen ihre umstrittenen Corona-Thesen. Sie fordern: „Sämtliche Maßnahmen sollten sofort aufgehoben werden.“
Was halten Sie von der Teststrategie der Bundes- und Landesregierungen? Wird zu viel getestet?
Ein Anlass bezogenes Testen halte ich für sinnvoller. Wir sind inzwischen bei einer Auslastung von 75 Prozent der Testkapazitäten und gefährden damit die Möglichkeiten auch gegen andere Viren weiterhin testen zu können – zum Beispiel gegen die Grippe.
Für wie realistisch halten Sie es denn, dass so eine Ampel kommt. Welchen Draht haben Sie in die Politik?
Ich sitze in verschiedenen internationalen und nationalen Expertengremien – unter anderem auch für das Bundesgesundheitsministerium. Darüber hinaus stelle ich fest, dass Politiker unterschiedlichster Couleur ein Interesse an einem Dialog mit mir haben.
Welche Argumentation ist denn zutreffender: Wir haben strenge Hygieneregeln, deshalb haben wir wenige Fälle. Und um die Fälle niedrig zu halten, müssen wir an den strengen Regeln festhalten. Oder: Es ging anfangs darum, die Infektionszahlen niedrig zu halten, um die Krankenhäuser nicht zu überlasten. Da der Überlastungsfall aber nicht eingetreten ist, können wir die strengen Regeln lockern.
Wir haben auf der einen Seite ein Präventionsparadoxon durch Hygieneregeln, andererseits ist die Überbelastung des Gesundheitssystems vor der Hygieneregelung, die im Frühjahr befürchtet wurde, ausgeblieben.
Sie sagen, dass wir am Ende des Jahres vielleicht gar nicht mehr Todesfälle haben als in anderen Jahren. Das müssen Sie erklären.
Jeder Tod ist eine Tragödie. Zu unserer Wahrheit gehört aber, dass in Deutschland durchschnittlich täglich 2500 Menschen sterben. Dabei sterben im Frühjahr und im Herbst mehr, und im Sommer weniger Menschen. Zur Zeit ist nicht erkennbar, dass wir eine höhere Sterberate dieses Jahr haben werden.
Ein Indikator für die Gefährlichkeit des Virus ist die Sterberate. Das RKI gibt diese mit 4,5 Prozent an, andere sprechen von 0,1 bis 0,2 Prozent. Sie gehen von 0,37 Prozent aus. Können Sie uns diese Abweichungen erklären?
Das RKI bezieht sich auf die gemeldeten Infektionsfälle und die gemeldeten Todesfälle. Das schließt die Dunkelziffer aus. Wenn man die Dunkelziffer mit berücksichtigt, wird die Zahl der Sterberate natürlich kleiner.
Hendrik Streeck wünscht sich eine Corona-Ampel.
+
Virologe Hendrik Streeck, Leiter der Heinsberg-Studie, wünscht sich eine Corona-Ampel.
© Hendrik Streeck

Zur Person

Hendrik Streeck (43) ist Professor für Virologie. Als Direktor des Institutes für Virologie und HIV-Forschung an der Medizinischen Fakultät der Universität Bonn ist er direkter Nachfolger von Professor Dr. Christian Drosten, der den Posten vorher innehatte und jetzt Institutsdirektor an der Charité in Berlin ist.

Mit der Heinsberg-Studie erlangte Streeck große Bekanntheit. Heinsberg ist der Landkreis, in dem das Coronavirus in Deutschland erstmals vermehrt auftrat. Für die Studie musste Streeck auch Kritik einstecken. Als er die ersten Ergebnisse am 9. April 2020 bekanntgab, empfahl er der Politik die Rücknahme der Beschränkungen. Diese Empfehlung wurde von anderen Virologen, auch von Drosten, kritisiert.

Streeck wurde in Göttingen geboren. Nach dem Zivildienst studierte er zunächst Musikwissenschaften und Betriebswirtschaftslehre, wechselte nach der Zwischenprüfung aber in die Humanmedizin und studierte an der Charité in Berlin. 2007 promovierte er an der Friedrich-Wilhelms-Universität Bonn. Nach mehreren Stationen übernahm er bis 2019 die Leitung des Instituts für HIV-Forschung an der Universität Duisburg-Essen. Seit 2019 ist er außerdem Kuratoriumsvorsitzender der deutschen AIDS Stiftung.

Lesen Sie hier: Ein Lungen-Experte aus Fulda spricht Klartext. Ex-Covid-Patient Manfred Hohmann ärgert sich über die Corona-Debatte. Und: Immunologe aus Fulda stellt fest: „Offenbar sind wir bereit, eine gewisse Todesrate zu akzeptieren“ Außerdem: Durch aktuelle Corona-Fälle müssen Klassen an drei Schulen im Landkreis Fulda in Quarantäne.
Eine Verschärfung der Regeln wurde in Berlin nun doch nicht beschlossen, ist aber diskutiert worden. Was halten Sie von dem Ergebnis?
Eine Pandemie ist ein volatiler Prozess. Ich bin mir sicher, dass die Ministerpräsidenten auch nicht das letzte Mal mit Frau Merkel in diesem Jahr darüber beraten haben. Für Großveranstaltungen hätte ich mir pragmatischere Lösungsansätze gewünscht. Wenn es das ausschließliche Ziel ist, die Infektionszahlen niedrigst zu halten, dann müssen Zusammenkünfte natürlich extrem beschränkt werden. Damit habe ich aber die Sorge, dass Infektionszahlen in der warmen Jahreszeit zwar unten gehalten, aber das Problem damit nur aufgeschoben wird.
Wie meinen Sie das?
Zunächst möchte ich festhalten, dass das Virus nicht verschwinden wird. Wir erzeugen zur Zeit einen künstlichen Staudamm, der am Ende vielleicht doch mehr Schaden anrichten könnte. Es gibt Hochrechnungen, dass Mumbai und New York mit keinen hohen Infektionszahlen mehr zu rechnen haben, weil dort bereits Herdenimmunität eingetreten ist. Auch in Schweden sinken die Fallzahlen, während Spanien und Deutschland mit einem Anstieg zu kämpfen haben. Ich will jetzt nicht Schweden als den besseren Weg verstanden wissen. Aber man muss realisieren, dass wir den einzig wahren Weg nicht kennen. Es ist entscheidend, dass wir ein lernendes System haben, in dem es erlaubt ist, Fehler zu machen. Ohne „Trial and Error“ funktioniert Wissenschaft nicht.
Häufig ist von einer zweiten Welle die Rede. Sie halten es für möglich, dass sich die Infektionszahlen im Herbst sogar verzehnfachen könnten. Klingt nach einem apokalyptischen Szenario…
Die Welle ist kein wissenschaftlicher Begriff. Die WHO spricht immer noch von der ersten Welle. Die Wellenthematik ist für Coronaviren müßig. Anders als Grippeviren, die oft verschwinden, tun das die meisten Coronaviren nicht. Daher müssen wir lernen, SARS-CoV2 in unser Leben zu integrieren.
Welche Maßnahmen schlagen Sie vor, um mit dem Virus zu leben?
Neben der Ampel wäre es sinnvoll, eine Spezialgruppe zu schaffen, die am Robert-Koch-Institut angesiedelt ist, und immer dann zum Einsatz kommt, wenn es irgendwo einen lokalen Hotspot gibt. Eine solche Gruppe, die mit jedem Mal Erfahrungen sammelt und sich mit Pandemie-Management auskennt, könnte helfen, die nötigen Maßnahmen schneller zu organisieren – wie eine Feuerwehr.
Vor allem für ältere Menschen ist eine Ansteckung gefährlich, für Nicht-Risikopatienten eher nicht. Sollte man vor diesem Hintergrund nicht eher die Risikogruppe besser schützen anstatt ein ganzes Land in den Lockdown zu fahren?
Eine solche inverse Isolation muss man kritisch sehen, da es wie das Wegsperren einer Generation aussieht. Schutz soll sein, aber die Frage, ob es nicht die Entscheidung zum Beispiel eines 90-Jährigen selbst ist, seine Enkelkinder zu sehen, muss erlaubt sein. Technisch sind wir so weit, dass man in Seniorenheimen Schnelltests von Besuchern machen könnte. So würde man durch andere Ressourcenverteilung zu einer besseren Normalität kommen.
Teil unserer neuen Normalität ist der Mund-Nasen-Schutz. Helfen diese Masken überhaupt?
Ja. Es gibt mittlerweile gute Daten, die zeigen, dass ein Mundschutz vor einer Ansteckung schützen kann. Sie halten Tröpfchen ab – auch wenn ein Virus theoretisch durch so einen Mundschutz passt. Es gibt zwar immer noch die Wahrscheinlichkeit der Infektion. Aber es setzt die Infektionsdosis herunter. Dadurch fördert man eine asymptomatische Infektion, also eine Infektion, die keine Symptome hervorruft.
Welche Rolle spielt die Infektionsdosis?
Je mehr Viren man abbekommt, desto schwerer sind die Symptome. Bei vielen Erkrankungen spielen Grenzwerte eine Rolle. Für die meisten Viren besteht ein starker Zusammenhang zwischen erster Infektionsdosis und den Symptomen. Also alles, was wir im Moment machen – Mundschutz tragen, Abstand halten – setzt die Infektionsdosis herunter. So sind wir auf einem guten Weg.
Gibt es Hinweise, dass sich das Virus verändert hat?
Das Virus verändert sich ständig. Es wurde gerade eine Mutation mit einem schwächeren Verlauf in Zusammenhang gebracht. Ob dies wirklich so ist, ist zu früh zu sagen.
Würden Sie derzeit in ein Flugzeug steigen?
Ich fliege innerhalb von Deutschland. Meinen Urlaub habe ich aber an der Nordsee verbracht, weil ich in dieser Zeit nicht so weit weg möchte, um greifbar zu sein. Ich kann es mir momentan auch nicht erlauben, in Quarantäne zu müssen.
Was hat Sie in den vergangenen Monaten bis heute im Umgang mit dem Virus am meisten überrascht?
Unser Wissen ist immer ein Wissen auf Zeit. Für mich war es als Virologe am überraschendsten, dass die Übertragung durch Aerosole in geschlossenen Räumen so eine bedeutende Rolle spielt.

Liebe Leser, dies war ein Teil des Interviews, welches unsere Zeitung mit dem Virologen, Professor Dr. Hendrik Streeck, geführt hat. Wenn Sie wissen möchten, was Herr Streeck über einen möglichen Impfstoff verrät, werden Sie im kompletten Interview aus der Samstagsausgabe (29. August) fündig. Falls Sie kein Abonnent sind, können Sie eine E-Paper-Ausgabe im Kiosk unserer Fuldaer Zeitungs-App kaufen: Für Android-Geräte im Google-Play-Store oder für iOS-Geräte im App-Store. (Weitere Fragen, beantwortet unser Kundenservice: 0661-280-310).
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[AmirBaa]

"Christopher Nolan, osim što je napravio revoluciju u historiji kinematografije svojim filmovima u kojima se filozofski poigrava pitanjem vremena, sada će biti upamćen kao reditelj zbog čijeg novog filmskog naslova ljudi riskiraju da se u kino dvoranama zaraze smrtonosnom bolešću zbog puke zabave. "

Jao, jao, gledaj opisa... Nema, odes u kino i sutra si mrtav, gotovo.

[ćiribiribela]

ja kada sam preladjen ili gripozan kod kuce prelezim...ne radim i ne hodam sa kafe na kafu...a kada sam zdrav koji ce mi k maska...jel hocete da pobjedimo virus ili da virus bude tu jos 5 godina...nosajte maske i virus ce cirkulisat stalno ovdje...nego ne jebite narod vise u zdrav mozak, reportaza iz splita, ja konto neka strava i uzas, leze im 3 pacijenta i sad oni ko prepadaju, jao kako je opako, vise se fotkale sestre i doktori...ludilo

A kako znas da si zdrav? Jesi li cuo za asimptomatske slucajeve? Jebote, jel moguce biti ovako sebican? Imas li u familiji nekoga starog ili bolesnog?

Znas li ikako koje je opterecenje za odjel ako ti na njemu leze "samo" tri intenzivna pacijenta? Je li znas da ne zna svaka sestra raditi sa takvim pacijentima, i da ti trebaju najmanje 2 sestre po smjeni za "samo" 3 takva pacijenta?

[_BataZiv_0809]

Sta ljepite te ponjave od tekstova jbt....stavi link i opisi sta si stavio i mirna bosna.

[zemomak]

ja kada sam preladjen ili gripozan kod kuce prelezim...ne radim i ne hodam sa kafe na kafu...a kada sam zdrav koji ce mi k maska...jel hocete da pobjedimo virus ili da virus bude tu jos 5 godina...nosajte maske i virus ce cirkulisat stalno ovdje...nego ne jebite narod vise u zdrav mozak, reportaza iz splita, ja konto neka strava i uzas, leze im 3 pacijenta i sad oni ko prepadaju, jao kako je opako, vise se fotkale sestre i doktori...ludilo

A kako znas da si zdrav? Jesi li cuo za asimptomatske slucajeve? Jebote, jel moguce biti ovako sebican? Imas li u familiji nekoga starog ili bolesnog?

Znas li ikako koje je opterecenje za odjel ako ti na njemu leze "samo" tri intenzivna pacijenta? Je li znas da ne zna svaka sestra raditi sa takvim pacijentima, i da ti trebaju najmanje 2 sestre po smjeni za "samo" 3 takva pacijenta?

nema zdravih, samo nepregledanih, jel tako...to da asimptomatski prenose je smjesno...vi u zdravstvu koji radite ste plaćeni da gurate ovu agendu, a nikad manje niste radili

[omar little]

cuj to, svedjani najvise promjene osjetili. kako to kad je kod njih zivot bio "po starom" i "bez restrikcija"...