MSNBC Komentari o hapšenju R.K.-Do it now!

[PipiDugaDevetka]

Vijest na MSNBC o hapšenju u autobusu GSP-a Beograd se može komentarisati. Uradite to i vi!
http://javabean.newsvine.com/_news/2008 ... dId=317096

[PipiDugaDevetka]

....Furthermore, in Bosnia, Muslim does not represent religion, but nationality!!! Serbians are from Serbia, Croatians from Croatia, and in 1970, late President of Yugoslavia, Marshall Tito, gave everyone else name Muslims (just to label them as something)... 100% of these people come from generations of families who were originally Serbians or Croatians but were forced to convert between 1300's and 1800's while Bosnia and majority of Serbia was enslaved by the Ottoman Empire...

Oh, ne @marija, ex. bosanka iz USA ochigledno ima dobre namjere, ali često i put do džehenema (Sirat ćuprija) zna biti asfaltiran dobrim namjerama.
Hajmo, engleskigovoreći forumaši, objasnite im,...

[PipiDugaDevetka]

anyone who kills muslimes can't be all that bad ? WTF !!!

Ko će odgovoriti ovom skotu @Scott-u?
http://javabean.newsvine.com/_news/2008 ... dId=317096
Da li bi pametan odgovor ovom skotu mogao biti:
Two bad (muslimes)-Milosh dead!?
Ne znam da li bi ovaj hitlerčić to razumio?

[mIRCerka]

anyone who kills muslimes can't be all that bad ? WTF !!!

Ko će odgovoriti ovom skotu @Scott-u?
http://javabean.newsvine.com/_news/2008 ... dId=317096
Da li bi pametan odgovor ovom skotu mogao biti:
Two bad (muslimes)-Milosh dead!?
Ne znam da li bi ovaj hitlerčić to razumio?

[PipiDugaDevetka]

Pipi balijo, mater ti jebem usranu, cabe se trudis da pokazes koliki si poturica.
0!#38 - Tue Jul 22, 2008 4:10 PM CEST

DaBg-da Kusturica snimao film o tebi i tvom mužu!

[PipiDugaDevetka]

Dragi forumaši,
Ovaj, @Z.D. tvrdi da to što je bilo u Srebrenici, a Srebrenica je u BiH, NIJE GENOCID u smislu značenja riječi GENOCID.
Ova diskusija prevazilazi moje znanje i imam osjećaj da je čovjek veoma upućen, (Chomski lično! )....ma, nemam šta nagadjati. Onaj kome je ovo blisko i zna znanje, molim da mu odgovori. On očito zaboravlja da kada pobiješ sve muškarce, nema više poroda,...uh....IMA LI IKOGA NA FORUMU DA MU KOMPETENTNO ODGOVORI?

VAŽNA NAPOMENA: Link se privremeno može samo pročitati, a uskoro će proraditi ponovo sa mogućnošću dodavanja komentara.
Vidi u dnu stranice ovu obavijest napisanu crvenim slovima.

Just for the sake of historical record -number of killed people in Bosnia is around 86.000(Peace be upon their souls) according to very detailed analasyss by special independant commision appointed for this task and not 250.000(thanks God or Allah) as various propagandists,misinformed journalists,calculative politicians and general fans of human horror-drama would like us to belive.
Also there was no genocide in Srebrenica but execution of Muslim fighters and number of inocent males( may their soul find a peace in love of Allah) .Rest of population was expeld.However this is not attempt on my part to downplay crimes commited, but attempt to prevent this apoling and quite destructive tendency of turning and twisting historical facts into antagonising myth which might one day be used to catapult future generations into new fratricide and madness.
It was horiffic enough as it was , so please no need to add up,blow up ,spin and misinform people.

1!#31.3 - Tue Jul 22, 2008 5:30 PM CESTZ.D.

I am not denying mass atrocities committed -I am not denying horrors that have happened or justifying "evil monsters".My point is that each side,politicians,media,and so on, manipulates this tragedy of civil war in order to fit whatever is their agenda- and that should stop!!!!Not only because is not nice to do so, but because that makes very deep wounds even deeper.You have retrograde elements in Serbia which claim that there was "only" 1300 people killed in Srebrenica,you have people who claim Serbs have killed 250.000 people in Bosnia, Serbs making up numbers,Muslims making up numbers,Croats making up numbers,international community making up numbers, - you have statistics about victims and displaced people in Bosnia that when you add up numbers turns out that there was1.500 000 more people living in Bosnia then it really was. Again that is at least to say not necessary, because what has happened over-there is already terrible enough.
Number of 86000 was number from two years ago established by independent commission - commission made out of experts from all three ethnic groups + international experts.This commission is still working.Their findings from middle of may 2008 are 92.207people(over 50% Muslims,over30% Serbs and bit less then 10% Croats).I hope that Mr.Rezak is wrong about "120 000-150 000" estimate not in order that turns out that I am right and hi is not,but simply because it means less people is killed-simple as that.
When I said there was no genocide in Srebrenica I was referring to meaning of word genocide.According to full meaning of this word if that was the case not only men would be killed but everybody else along with them.However I apologize to everyone touched or offended, for been technical over so deeply tragical and emotional issue. It is my hart's belief that in order to start healing process we should stop ,to the degree, using words such as-genocide-ethnic cleansing-war crimes-colateral damage,destructivley polarising"us and them rhetoric",etc., and start contemplating on word and it's meaning, which is much closer to reality of war events in Bosnia(and rest of former Yugoslavia) - FRATRICIDE!

[mIRCerka]

Pipi balijo, mater ti jebem usranu, cabe se trudis da pokazes koliki si poturica.
0!#38 - Tue Jul 22, 2008 4:10 PM CEST

DaBg-da Kusturica snimao film o tebi i tvom mužu!

dzebote, povratih, dvoje mu je reklo da ide kopat nos a ja zamislila nosinu , pravu hercegovacku (kakvu i sama nosim) i ZNAM sta sve moze tu da se nadje


nego, sta bi, pala stranica a?

[luciferino]

ev, proradilo...komentar postavljen...

[PipiDugaDevetka]

ev, proradilo...komentar postavljen...

Vidio sam, bog si ove hefte, a i šire.

[AO83]

anyone who kills muslimes can't be all that bad ? WTF !!!

Ko će odgovoriti ovom skotu @Scott-u?
http://javabean.newsvine.com/_news/2008 ... dId=317096
Da li bi pametan odgovor ovom skotu mogao biti:
Two bad (muslimes)-Milosh dead!?
Ne znam da li bi ovaj hitlerčić to razumio?

Mislim da se desava nesporazum izmedju Vas i Scotta - Scott zapravo postavlja pitanje "ko god ubija muslimane nije tako los?" i zavrsava recenicu sa "wtf!!!" sto bih ja laicki prevao Cuj to yebote!!!

Znaci da Scott je neko ko je zapravo sarkastican, i zeli da kaze da je totalno absurdno reci da ko god ubija muslimane nemoze biti los.

U VEZI TEME: Ovi komentari ionako nisu shvatani za ozbiljno posto svako zna da se nafuraju pojedinci koji opravdavaju ili se protive prici bila ta prica o Karadzicu ili o Britney Spears. Mislim da je vazniji kontekst price jer to sto u kontekstu je bas ono sto ce biti prikazano na TV ekranima. Imao sam priliku da pratim CNN prenos i veoma sam zadovoljan sta je americka publika imala priliku da vidi. Program na NPR-u jutros u vezi Karadzica je bio informativan i mislim da ga je Senad H. pravio nebi bolje ispalo.

[PipiDugaDevetka]

@AO83,
Ja sam mislio da se ovo WTF odnosi na samu vijest, odnosno hapšenje, kao: Što ga uhapsiše budale, kad je dobar bio, y...bte!
Ma, nebitno ....Možda se @Scott neće ni vratiti da vidi komentare, uostalom mi smo marginala za,....Neke bitne zemlje,...

[PipiDugaDevetka]

You lead yourself to your conclusions,no one else.Is international court retarded? -I do not think so.
Did you really get my point?Considering beginning of your comment ,I would say you did not.Considering end of your comment I would say yes you did.Words are words and tragic reality is tragic reality.I agree with conclusion of your comment 100%.

On other hand words do have a power,they carry a meaning,wich creates an impression,wich in turn becomes seed of future action(s) and events.
Truth is that every 30-50 years on average and sometimes more frequently there is war in Balkans.After each of them every ethnic group and I mean every ethnic group tends to distort the facts and stretch them in all directions,from denial to accusation.On the top of already devastating tragedies they create national myths full of grudge,chauvinsm,hate and unresolved pain.This myths tend to sink in collective soul of each group where they boil and boil to the point of new explosion,which will turn into new tragedies and horrors.On a top of this we have manipulative world politics + sensationalistic and very often superficial international media(I was mainly referring my comments to them) that loves to indulge in tragedy ,loves to make up facts and steer our emotions in various directions for various purposes and agendas.For sake of record,sometimes they are truthful and sincere but not very often, also it is worth noting ,since we are here, that partial truth presented as whole truth is worse then lying.
Loaded numbers and loaded words are not helping the healing and reconciliation.Polarization along collective lines does not lead to peace.Deniyal of destructive primitivism and projection of it only unto others will not yield forgiveness.So my proposal is - some Serbs have committed FRATRICIDE in Srebrenica- some Serbs committed Fratricide over Muslims and Croats,some Muslims also have committed FRATRICIDE over Serbs and Croats, and some Croats have committed FRATRICIDE over Serbs and Muslims.Number of killed brothers and sisters in this war is-Muslim brothers and sisters over 50%,Serbian brothers and sisters over 30% and Croat brothers and sisters under 10%, -Life ruined for all -

CHOMSKY, lično.... ,.....Ne odustaje od svog FRATRICIDA (Ja, nikad čuo da to postoji), govori o STRANAMA, političarima,...svi smo mu isti mi, što svakih 50 godina ratujemo,....
@lucifeeeeeeeerrrnoooooooooooo! Imrdžensi,...HOĆU REPLIKU KVALITETNU I POHVALI GA DA DOBRO POZNAJE STVARI!

[luciferino]

Hocu pipice, hocu, cekaj sekundicu da zavrsim prevodcic.
Nije on Chomsky, on zastupa tezu kako je rat bio bratoubilacki i nema pojma sta je fratricid po definiciji...kada rodjeni brat ubije brata. Znaci, po njegovom su srbi i muslimani bratja rodjena.

Bezze mu je teza skroz, a mislim da vrlo dobro razumije nash jezik.

[mIRCerka]

Hocu pipice, hocu, cekaj sekundicu da zavrsim prevodcic.
Nije on Chomsky, on zastupa tezu kako je rat bio bratoubilacki i nema pojma sta je fratricid po definiciji...kada rodjeni brat ubije brata. Znaci, po njegovom su srbi i muslimani bratja rodjena.

Bezze mu je teza skroz, a mislim da vrlo dobro razumije nash jezik.

iskocilo se iz te definicije kad su nakon GRADJANSKI poceli rat zvati BRATOUBILACKIM...
Ma one debile treba otjerat u materinu da prostite...sto ga vise vrijedjas ili mu objasnjavas, to je se on vise upali...

[luciferino]

Hocu pipice, hocu, cekaj sekundicu da zavrsim prevodcic.
Nije on Chomsky, on zastupa tezu kako je rat bio bratoubilacki i nema pojma sta je fratricid po definiciji...kada rodjeni brat ubije brata. Znaci, po njegovom su srbi i muslimani bratja rodjena.

Bezze mu je teza skroz, a mislim da vrlo dobro razumije nash jezik.

iskocilo se iz te definicije kad su nakon GRADJANSKI poceli rat zvati BRATOUBILACKIM...
Ma one debile treba otjerat u materinu da prostite...sto ga vise vrijedjas ili mu objasnjavas, to je se on vise upali...

Evo, odgovorila sam:
I understood your comment perfectly, but I am quite sure you have no idea what fratricide means OR you are twisting the definition to prove your point. Serbs, Croats and Bosniacs are as brothers as you and me, if we take into consideration that we all came from Adam and Eve. Loaded Numbers do not help I agree, but you go and tell a mother from Srebrenica that it was FRATRICIDE, and that some imaginary Serbian brother killed her sons and husband and brothers and father, and raped her mother and sisters. Let's see how helpful and fair that is. I say it is a lame try stinking of a well-known "brotherhood ideology" that hit the peoples of Yugoslavia like a klix little boomerang, especially Bosniacs, Bosnia and those who carry Bosnia in their hearts. I bet you think that we had a civil war as well, and that tells me everything.

Nek se materi pali...ja garantujem da je gospodin iz ex-Yu dijaspore.
Josh da mi pocne pjevati Imagine, koji idealizam...da povratish (uz izvinjenje Lennonu)

[samo gost]

Ne mogu da otvorim stranicu, ali ako neko ima manje problema s tim evo linka koji je jedini pravi odgovor ovom Z.D. 'poznavaocu' međunarodnog prava, a to je link na presudu Međunarodnog suda pravde u Hagu u predmetu BiH vs. Serbia u kojem je jasno napisano i UTVRĐENO da je u Srebrenici bio GENOCID. Ova njegova lupetanja, a posebno ovaj 'fratricid' ne zaslužuju komentar, osim da mu svaki put kad nešto posta neko odgovori linkom na presudu.

http://www.icj-cij.org/icjwww/idocket/i ... yframe.htm

[samo gost]

Ovo je ustvari link koji vodi direktno na presudu. Ja i dalje imam problema da otvorim bilo šta, ali evo da ima kogod uspije komentarisati postove ovog lika Z.D.

http://www.icj-cij.org/docket/files/91/13685.pdf

[luciferino]

Ovo je ustvari link koji vodi direktno na presudu. Ja i dalje imam problema da otvorim bilo šta, ali evo da ima kogod uspije komentarisati postove ovog lika Z.D.

http://www.icj-cij.org/docket/files/91/13685.pdf

Ne mogu postaviti linkove, uklone mi ih iz posta. Nemojte se puno nervirati za ovaj fratricide jer se momak nalupao. Cuj ti njega...braca i sestre. Uostalom takva ideja bratstva i fratricida po definiciji sigurno nije svojstvena engleskom govornom podrucju. Izdalo ga bratstvo i jedinstvo...

[PipiDugaDevetka]

Samo za @samo gost-a:

No need to go back to biblical times,Serbs,Croats and Bosniacs are south Slavs,speaking same language and resembling each other in mentality and temperament,having their slavic gods and common religious customs.They were one people before divided by "religious tools" of western and eastern roman empire,religious reaction to eastern christian church(Bogumils) and later by Islam brought by Ottoman empire. "Brotherhood ideology" was only a political concept and unfortunately has never become "well known" deeply understood and truly worked on it-obviously, it was for many people just a slogan,something to ignore or something to indulge in mock tolerance and political correctness.If it was truly understood and sincerely accepted maybe,just maybe tragedy of war would not happened.Since that was not the case result is known.
But on a pragmatic side and for sake of argument if I had to choose between "stinking and lame brotherhood ideology" and bloodthirsty chauvinism, I would choose first option .
To resolve deeply complex matters people will have to come closer(for real ,not on surface) or there will be no solution and no peace-simple as that.
Polarisation,hate,selfpity,national pride,ethnicly cleansed territories,inividuals hiding from evils they have committed,people not ready to admit their deeds(no matter how big or small) and ask for forgiveness,people not ready to forgive,propaganda of all sorts from all sides,political manipulation and corruption-local as well as international,loss of wider perspective,-that is not a road to better life.
As far as mothers and sisters of Srebrenica are concerned no words can compensate their pain and loss.I would not tell them while patting them friendly on their back and smiling-Oh it is not so terrible,it is only brother killing brother- or -Oh it is so terrible( not that is not -just to be clear) they committed Genocide! But I would express my deep condolences and I would also say how tragic is that many people(in Bosnia and in general) do not (many also do know this)realise that they are much closer to each other then they think or know- if they knew they would not do it what they did.
Was it a civil war?Well if it was not known that Milosevic and Tudjman were siting and friendly,over dinner(figurativley speaking) chatting about how to divide Bosnia,while at a same time involving in Bosnia militarily,logisticly and politically I would say it was civil war-but knowing what is known I would not say that tragedy in Bosnia was civil war. How you or I want to see things ,that is our thing.But I would like to see from media and politicians much more conctructive and stimulative effort towards reconciliation and healing.

Meni ovo liči na Lajčakovu, a i ostalih iz MZ, mantru: Vaši političari to moraju, Birajte prave političare,...etc., a atletičaru (BiH) polomili kičmu, ruke svezali u luđačku košulju, noge takodje, polomili i razvukli mu pamet na dvoje (51%:49%), pa hajde ti sada trči prema EU - cilju, ekonomskom i svakom drugom prosperitetu,...obavezno se pomiri, zaboravi presudu Suda pravde,...

[luciferino]

Hajd bar nijednom nije rekao fratricid.
Pogodili ga Adam i Eva đe treba

[samo gost]

Hvala @pipi. Pročitah, pa kako nisam baš najbolje upratila šta pisac hoće da kaže (ne zbog engleskog, da se razumijemo), mislila sam moći ću još jednom. Ali, već odavno znam da je život kratak da bi se i sekunda nepotrebno gubila na razne likove, pa sam odustala. Jeste, ovo baš zvuči kao baljezganje raznoraznih 'eksperata' koji nas pohodiše i koji sve o nama jako dobro znaju. Znaju i šta trebamo, samo smo mi priglupi i nikako da shvatimo.

Evo ovaj sad bulazni o 'braći'. Znači samo trebamo skontati da su braća poklala braću u Srebrenici i svima će nam biti lakše? To je nevjerovatno - šta se sve neće izmisliti da se pobjegne od davno definisanog genocida. Zato 'brat' Z.D. treba čitati presudu Međunarodnog suda pravde, a ovi naši jadni političari bi, umjesto svojih patetičnih i polupismenih govora, mogli čitati dijelove te presude kadgod je potrebno.

[luciferino]

Kopirala sam mu dio ICJ odluke gdje se jasno i glasno kaze da se radilo o genocidu. I nije nista nevjerovatno u njegovom izlaganju. To je vrlo ucestalo misljenje onih koji nisu bash extremisti, ali ce uvijek govoriti kako su svi isti, zrtve bratoubilackog rata, dok agresije na BiH nije bilo. Po njihovom misljenju, sada se svi trebamo fino izmiriti i izljubiti i kao slavenska braca (zato su Adam i Eva spomenuti, jer ako cemo vec traziti zajednicki korjen...) a truhli zapad nas je zavadio. Da se razumijemo, ja Bosnjak nisam, ali ce mi od ovakvih Z.D. likova vazda biti muka. Sramotno je koliko je to zadojeno i ne zeli priznati.

[samo gost]

Napisah 'nevjerovatno' čisto zato što sam na umu imala, a nisam napisala, sasvim uspio pokušaj (sad već pretvoren u praksu potpuno usvojenu pred Tribunalom) da se djela koja ulaze u definiciju genocida kvalifikuju kao 'etničko čišćenje'. Gluplje konstrukcije nisam čula, ali ona je jedva dočekana i instalirana da bi se pobjeglo od definicije genocida. Nije to čudo, naravno, imajući u vdiu kojim bi se još državama genocid mogao pripisati, a ovako imamo, eto, benignije ( ) 'etničko čišćenje'.

I onda idu, naravno, ove priče o bratoubilačkom ratu i, naravno, pomirenju.