A cuj, ne postoji nesto sto bi se zvalo "zvanicni stav siitske uleme" o tome i slicnim pitanjima. Mnogi alimi ce ti reci da je tako, neki imaju drugu ili trecu teoriju. Postoje knjige koje ljudi pisu u odbranu te teze, navode svoje argumente iz Starog Zavjeta (narocito iz Knjige Danijelove, jer tu se govori o izbavljenju Zidova iz babilonskog ropstva, a to je upravo Kirovo Djelo), iz islamske tradicije (neke predaje siitskih imama) do toga da se pozivaju na neke drevne prikaze Kira na kojima se vidi da je nosio sljem sa dva roga (Zulkarnejn znaci Dvorogi, posjednik dva roga). Uglavnom, takve teme su otvorene za raspravu, interpretacije, argumentaciju...Kikibombona wrote:Narod koji ima glavu i rep, koji ne luta, koji zna ko je i sta je, koji se ponosi time!zvizdan wrote:
Eh, malo je reci da se ponose. Medjutim, oni svoje pretke ne smatraju nikakvim paganima nego ljudima koji su slijedili jednu od predislamskih Objava. Stavise, uvrijezen je stav da je Boziji poslanik Zulkarnejn spomenut u Kur'anu bio upravo Kir Veliki (za to se navodi mnostvo argumenata, ali nebitno sad). Uostalom, trecina Iranaca nose staroperzijska imena: Dariuš, Ardešir, Araš, Arman, Behzad, Daneš, Feridun, Homayun (muska), ili Širin, Afsane, Anahita, Arya, Lida, Parisa... (zenska) Dovoljno valjda govori i to sto se odrzala tradicija Nou Ruza (njihove nove godine), u islamu je dobila nove sadrzaje, neke nove interpretacije, ali i sacuvala neke obicaje i tradicije stare barem do Sasanida, a vjerovatno i dalje unatrag.
Opisati odnos Iranaca prema njihovom drevnom (cak i mitskom) naslijedju je bas duga prica.
Zato i jesu svjetlosnim godinama u odnosu na Arape!
Ako zaista smatraju da je Kir Veliki bio poslanik, onda je to maestralan politicki potez.
Da li je to zvanicni stav iransko-siitske uleme ili o tome nagadjaju kojekakvi ekscentrici??
IRAN
-
zvizdan
- Posts: 935
- Joined: 06/11/2006 20:33
#10251 Re: IRAN
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10252 Re: IRAN
Kako mislis?insomnia78 wrote:Ovo sa danasnjim Iranom ima veze isto ko Bakir sa poveljom Kulina banapirpa wrote:IRANIAN INVENTIONS
SYSTEMS AND WAY OF LIFE
• Protocol and Etiquette- rules of respect, cultured civilization, of order and harmony of everyday life.
• Human Rights – 576 B.C. , cylinder of Cyrus the Great
• System of State and Regions – created by Cyrus the Great (Satrap and Satrapies)
• Iran was The First Real Empire
• First Agriculture System -1000 B.C., the Qanat
• Police- first inspectors were “the Eye of the King” created by Cyrus
• Postal Service – by Cyrus the Great
• First Monotheist Religion- 6000 B.C.,
• The Three Kings (bible)- zoroastrians = iranians
MEDICINE:
• Alcohol in Medicine – 864 A.D. , by Rhazès Zakarya
• Founder Book of Modern Medicine- 980 A.D, created by Avicenna
• First Teaching Hospital – 271 B.C., intellectual centre teaching philosophy , medicine, theology, science.
• Anesthesia- 1000 A.D. for the birth of Rostam
• Cesarean – 1000 A.D. the earliest file of ceasarean is in the Shah Nameh, Rostam was born this way
INSTRUMENTS:
• Guitar- 5000 B.C. Gui means three in old persian and Tar means rope, guitar had three ropes at the beginning and changed with time
• Oldest Ancestor of the Piano – 266 B.C. called tympanon (santur)
CLOTHES:
• Shoes- 3000 B.C. found in Iran
• Sandals- 3000 B.C.
• Boots- 3000 B.C.
• Trousers- first trousers were worn in the Achemenid period
• Gloves and Mittens- known as a Greek invention but before that, Xenophon already talked about Persians wearing mittens.
SPORT
• Backgammon – 1400 B.C., found in the Sistan-e-Baloutchestan region
• Polo – 521 B.C., persian sport
• Chess – the base of the game invented in India but it was played with dice and by four people, the evolution was made in Iran
• Poker – 1600 A.D. persian game called “nas”, iranians showed it to french in louisiana and they one showed the game to the world
FOOD
• Refrigerator- 400 B.C. a large room called YAKCHAL
• Wine – 5400 B.C., Invention of Wine. Discovery made by University of Pennsylvania excavations at Hajji Firuz Tepe in northwestern Iran.
• Grape
• Kabab – first kind of kabab was the persian Kabab
• Biscuit, Cookies - 700 A.D.
• Rice
• Ice Cream – 400 B.C.
• Yoghurt
OTHER AMAZING THINGS:
• Battery- 250 B.C. found in Iran
• Coloured Eggs for Easter – Persians first began using coloured eggs to celebrate spring in 3000 BC. Crusaders returning from the Middle East spread the costume of colouring eggs and Europeans began to use them to celebrate Easter.
• Valentines (a day of Love) was first founded by Cyrus the Great
• Air Conditioning
• Windmill – 632 A.D
• Introduction of Paper in Occident – 700 A.D.
• Algebra- 800 A.D. Khwarizmi was an Iranian from Khorassan
• First Attempt to Fly- key kawoos, who fell three times
• Tulip – persian flower
• Rose – persian flower
• Ceramic
• Bazaar
• Thousand and One Nights – stories told by Sharzad
• Improvement of the Shisha - during the kingdom, Iran improved the hookah from his simple basic form to what it is today
• The Brick – 6000 B.C.
• First Pearls- 5000 B.C. , found in the border of Persian Gulf, a necklace of three lines of pearls owned by a Persian princess
• The Water Bed – 3600 B.C. made of sheep’s skin
• Art of Miniatures – 2600 B.C.
• Chariot – 2000 B.C
- asurbanipal
- Posts: 6692
- Joined: 28/06/2010 15:54
- Location: opet sam ti u kafani
#10253 Re: IRAN
Kikibombona wrote:Narod koji ima glavu i rep, koji ne luta, koji zna ko je i sta je, koji se ponosi time!zvizdan wrote:
Eh, malo je reci da se ponose. Medjutim, oni svoje pretke ne smatraju nikakvim paganima nego ljudima koji su slijedili jednu od predislamskih Objava. Stavise, uvrijezen je stav da je Boziji poslanik Zulkarnejn spomenut u Kur'anu bio upravo Kir Veliki (za to se navodi mnostvo argumenata, ali nebitno sad). Uostalom, trecina Iranaca nose staroperzijska imena: Dariuš, Ardešir, Araš, Arman, Behzad, Daneš, Feridun, Homayun (muska), ili Širin, Afsane, Anahita, Arya, Lida, Parisa... (zenska) Dovoljno valjda govori i to sto se odrzala tradicija Nou Ruza (njihove nove godine), u islamu je dobila nove sadrzaje, neke nove interpretacije, ali i sacuvala neke obicaje i tradicije stare barem do Sasanida, a vjerovatno i dalje unatrag.
Opisati odnos Iranaca prema njihovom drevnom (cak i mitskom) naslijedju je bas duga prica.
Zato i jesu svjetlosnim godinama u odnosu na Arape!
Ako zaista smatraju da je Kir Veliki bio poslanik, onda je to maestralan politicki potez.
Da li je to zvanicni stav iransko-siitske uleme ili o tome nagadjaju kojekakvi ekscentrici??
To je stav jednog od najvećih šiitskih ali i muslimanskih alima uopšte u prošlom stoljeću - Allamah Tabatabaija.

Inače, Tabatabai je usvojio stav od sunnitskog učenjaka iz Indije, također velikana u svoje vrijeme - Mawlana Abul Kamal Azada...

Inače, Mawlana Azad je imao široko obrazovanje, a istakao se kao politički vođa indijskog pokreta za nezavisnost. Nakon indijske nezavisnosti, on je postao prvi ministar obrazovanja u indijskoj vladi. Godine 1992. posthumno mu je dodijeljena najveća indijska civilna nagrada, Bharat Ratna.
Imaš danas autora koji smatraju da je u stvari Aleksandar Makedonski bio Zul'Karnejn, međutim, kao neko ko se bavi historijskom naukom, smatram da je Kir Veliki i po osvajanjima i po svojoj mudroj vladavini i politici za nekoliko kopalja ispred. Židovi ga također spominju u pozitivnom svjetlu i odaju mu počasti, budući da ih je spasio od ropstva...
Što se tiče mitologije, dosta sam izučavao semitsku, zatim indijansku, skandinavsku, japansku, slavensku, ali mi je perzijska mitologija jedna od dražih, ako ne i najdraža. Onaj njihov mitski junak Rustem mi je čak i na san izlazio...
- pirpa
- Posts: 3832
- Joined: 22/02/2012 18:16
#10254 Re: IRAN
sve se vidi u njihovom vođenju vanjske politike, ameri igraju kao majmuncic na kanafi.insomnia78 wrote: Ovo sa danasnjim Iranom ima veze isto ko Bakir sa poveljom Kulina bana
- General War
- Posts: 24423
- Joined: 18/09/2013 22:04
#10255 Re: IRAN
insomnia78 wrote:Ovo sa danasnjim Iranom ima veze isto ko Bakir sa poveljom Kulina banapirpa wrote:IRANIAN INVENTIONS
SYSTEMS AND WAY OF LIFE
• Protocol and Etiquette- rules of respect, cultured civilization, of order and harmony of everyday life.
• Human Rights – 576 B.C. , cylinder of Cyrus the Great
• System of State and Regions – created by Cyrus the Great (Satrap and Satrapies)
• Iran was The First Real Empire
• First Agriculture System -1000 B.C., the Qanat
• Police- first inspectors were “the Eye of the King” created by Cyrus
• Postal Service – by Cyrus the Great
• First Monotheist Religion- 6000 B.C.,
• The Three Kings (bible)- zoroastrians = iranians
MEDICINE:
• Alcohol in Medicine – 864 A.D. , by Rhazès Zakarya
• Founder Book of Modern Medicine- 980 A.D, created by Avicenna
• First Teaching Hospital – 271 B.C., intellectual centre teaching philosophy , medicine, theology, science.
• Anesthesia- 1000 A.D. for the birth of Rostam
• Cesarean – 1000 A.D. the earliest file of ceasarean is in the Shah Nameh, Rostam was born this way
INSTRUMENTS:
• Guitar- 5000 B.C. Gui means three in old persian and Tar means rope, guitar had three ropes at the beginning and changed with time
• Oldest Ancestor of the Piano – 266 B.C. called tympanon (santur)
CLOTHES:
• Shoes- 3000 B.C. found in Iran
• Sandals- 3000 B.C.
• Boots- 3000 B.C.
• Trousers- first trousers were worn in the Achemenid period
• Gloves and Mittens- known as a Greek invention but before that, Xenophon already talked about Persians wearing mittens.
SPORT
• Backgammon – 1400 B.C., found in the Sistan-e-Baloutchestan region
• Polo – 521 B.C., persian sport
• Chess – the base of the game invented in India but it was played with dice and by four people, the evolution was made in Iran
• Poker – 1600 A.D. persian game called “nas”, iranians showed it to french in louisiana and they one showed the game to the world
FOOD
• Refrigerator- 400 B.C. a large room called YAKCHAL
• Wine – 5400 B.C., Invention of Wine. Discovery made by University of Pennsylvania excavations at Hajji Firuz Tepe in northwestern Iran.
• Grape
• Kabab – first kind of kabab was the persian Kabab
• Biscuit, Cookies - 700 A.D.
• Rice
• Ice Cream – 400 B.C.
• Yoghurt
OTHER AMAZING THINGS:
• Battery- 250 B.C. found in Iran
• Coloured Eggs for Easter – Persians first began using coloured eggs to celebrate spring in 3000 BC. Crusaders returning from the Middle East spread the costume of colouring eggs and Europeans began to use them to celebrate Easter.
• Valentines (a day of Love) was first founded by Cyrus the Great
• Air Conditioning
• Windmill – 632 A.D
• Introduction of Paper in Occident – 700 A.D.
• Algebra- 800 A.D. Khwarizmi was an Iranian from Khorassan
• First Attempt to Fly- key kawoos, who fell three times
• Tulip – persian flower
• Rose – persian flower
• Ceramic
• Bazaar
• Thousand and One Nights – stories told by Sharzad
• Improvement of the Shisha - during the kingdom, Iran improved the hookah from his simple basic form to what it is today
• The Brick – 6000 B.C.
• First Pearls- 5000 B.C. , found in the border of Persian Gulf, a necklace of three lines of pearls owned by a Persian princess
• The Water Bed – 3600 B.C. made of sheep’s skin
• Art of Miniatures – 2600 B.C.
• Chariot – 2000 B.C
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10257 Re: IRAN
Ipak je bilo: "Keru lezi, zeno citaj!" 
Iran IRGCN moment of arrest 10 American Marines on their knees لحظه دستگیری ۱۰ تفنگدار آمریکایی سپاه
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5H6nHpH8Pfk [/youtube]
Iran IRGCN moment of arrest 10 American Marines on their knees لحظه دستگیری ۱۰ تفنگدار آمریکایی سپاه
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5H6nHpH8Pfk [/youtube]
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10258 Re: IRAN
Uleti mi poziv, zakasnih postaviti i Pirpa mi uze mustuluk 
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10260 Re: IRAN
General War wrote:Vako se to radi
Lahko je bilo udarat onoga koga svi cipelare, haj´sad mrco!
-
zvizdan
- Posts: 935
- Joined: 06/11/2006 20:33
#10261 Re: IRAN
Fascinantno, fakat. Usput jos oboris i putnicki avion, ubijes 291 neduznog covjeka, ali ko ih hebe, to su i onako samo zaostali Istocnjaci. Nakon toga predsjednik licno dodijeli ti orden za doprinos smanjenju broja divljaka u svijetu. Sve onako demokraCki i u skladu s ljuCkim pravima.salik79 wrote:General War wrote:Vako se to radi
Lahko je bilo udarat onoga koga svi cipelare, haj´sad mrco!Keru lezi!
- General War
- Posts: 24423
- Joined: 18/09/2013 22:04
#10262 Re: IRAN
salik79 wrote:General War wrote:Vako se to radi
Lahko je bilo udarat onoga koga svi cipelare, haj´sad mrco!Keru lezi, zeno citaj!
De mi reci, ima li u iranu stolica i stolova?
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10263 Re: IRAN
Sta ima avion pun bradatih divljaka letat Perzijskim zaljevom!? Ha ja! Orden, nego sta! Pitaj Generala Trola...zvizdan wrote:Fascinantno, fakat. Usput jos oboris i putnicki avion, ubijes 291 neduznog covjeka, ali ko ih hebe, to su i onako samo zaostali Istocnjaci. Nakon toga predsjednik licno dodijeli ti orden za doprinos smanjenju broja divljaka u svijetu. Sve onako demokraCki i u skladu s ljuCkim pravima.salik79 wrote:General War wrote:Vako se to radi
Lahko je bilo udarat onoga koga svi cipelare, haj´sad mrco!Keru lezi!
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10264 Re: IRAN
Imal´u Guantanamu?! Ah, da, to je KubaGeneral War wrote:salik79 wrote:General War wrote:Vako se to radi
Lahko je bilo udarat onoga koga svi cipelare, haj´sad mrco!Keru lezi, zeno citaj!
![]()
De mi reci, ima li u iranu stolica i stolova?
- General War
- Posts: 24423
- Joined: 18/09/2013 22:04
#10265 Re: IRAN
... a trol sa culafom zaboravio da su prije toga umjereno bradati sijali mine i napadali komercijalne brodovesalik79 wrote: Sta ima avion pun bradatih divljaka letat Perzijskim zaljevom!? Ha ja! Orden, nego sta! Pitaj Generala Trola...
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10266 Re: IRAN
I to daje za pravo civiliziranoj i demokratskoj USA da obori putnicki avion sa, haman, 300 ljudi (CIVILA) u njemu?!General War wrote:... a trol sa culafom zaboravio da su prije toga umjereno bradati sijali mine i napadali komercijalne brodovesalik79 wrote: Sta ima avion pun bradatih divljaka letat Perzijskim zaljevom!? Ha ja! Orden, nego sta! Pitaj Generala Trola...
- General War
- Posts: 24423
- Joined: 18/09/2013 22:04
#10267 Re: IRAN
...to daje pravo da budu nervozni na obaracu uz miroljubive homeinijeve hurije...sto ne oborise iznad kuvajta, bahreina...?salik79 wrote:I to daje za pravo civiliziranoj i demokratskoj USA da obori putnicki avion sa, haman, 300 ljudi (CIVILA) u njemu?!General War wrote:... a trol sa culafom zaboravio da su prije toga umjereno bradati sijali mine i napadali komercijalne brodovesalik79 wrote: Sta ima avion pun bradatih divljaka letat Perzijskim zaljevom!? Ha ja! Orden, nego sta! Pitaj Generala Trola...
plus priznali gresku, izvinuli se...iskesirali odstetu porodicama...sto bas drugima i ne ide od ruke
-
zvizdan
- Posts: 935
- Joined: 06/11/2006 20:33
#10268 Re: IRAN
Covjek koji u rukavu ima opravdanje za rusenje putnickog aviona i ubistvo 291 zene, dijeteta i muskarca...General War wrote:... a trol sa culafom zaboravio da su prije toga umjereno bradati sijali mine i napadali komercijalne brodovesalik79 wrote: Sta ima avion pun bradatih divljaka letat Perzijskim zaljevom!? Ha ja! Orden, nego sta! Pitaj Generala Trola...
Jadan ne bio, sve i da su sijali mine, sijali su ih u SVOJE more, NE u americko. Jel poginuo neki civil mozda od tih mina? Sta rade uopce americki ratni brodovi u Perzijskom zalivu? Tako to treba, jelde?
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10269 Re: IRAN
Ko ba prizno gresku?! Dodjelom ordena zapovjedniku?! To nije nikakva greska, nego namjerno obaranje putnickog aviona. Za to nema nikakvog opravdanja. I koju "odstetu"?! Da im i ja isto toliko dam...General War wrote:salik79 wrote:...to daje pravo da budu nervozni na obaracu uz miroljubive homeinijeve hurije...sto ne oborise iznad kuvajta, bahreina...?General War wrote:
I to daje za pravo civiliziranoj i demokratskoj USA da obori putnicki avion sa, haman, 300 ljudi (CIVILA) u njemu?!
plus priznali gresku, izvinuli se...iskesirali odstetu porodicama...sto bas drugima i ne ide od ruke
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10270 Re: IRAN
Fakat, de nam reci, kakav je osjecaj vama, amerofilima, gledati US Marines u ovom "ponizavajucem" polozaju?! 
- asurbanipal
- Posts: 6692
- Joined: 28/06/2010 15:54
- Location: opet sam ti u kafani
#10271 Re: IRAN
zvizdan wrote:Covjek koji u rukavu ima opravdanje za rusenje putnickog aviona i ubistvo 291 zene, dijeteta i muskarca...General War wrote:... a trol sa culafom zaboravio da su prije toga umjereno bradati sijali mine i napadali komercijalne brodovesalik79 wrote: Sta ima avion pun bradatih divljaka letat Perzijskim zaljevom!? Ha ja! Orden, nego sta! Pitaj Generala Trola...Ne dao drag Bog nikome takvo stanje duha i uma...
Jadan ne bio, sve i da su sijali mine, sijali su ih u SVOJE more, NE u americko. Jel poginuo neki civil mozda od tih mina? Sta rade uopce americki ratni brodovi u Perzijskom zalivu? Tako to treba, jelde?
Zemo, ne treba trošiti vrijeme i riječi na ovog poklonika rasizma i nacizma. Samo ignore...
- Tabhana
- Posts: 3133
- Joined: 09/02/2015 11:41
- Location: Titin RAtsoM
#10272 Re: IRAN
Šteta pa su šiije
Imate li vi rane po leđima od šibanja mačem?
Imate li vi rane po leđima od šibanja mačem?
- salik79
- Posts: 27013
- Joined: 16/09/2013 13:15
#10273 Re: IRAN
Tabhana wrote:Šteta pa su šiije![]()
Imate li vi rane po leđima od šibanja mačem?
Odoh se ranit
- Challenger__
- Posts: 26509
- Joined: 25/03/2012 09:31
- Location: In weiter Ferne, so nah!
- Contact:
#10274 Re: IRAN
+1asurbanipal wrote:Zemo, ne treba trošiti vrijeme i riječi na ovog poklonika rasizma i nacizma. Samo ignore...zvizdan wrote:
Covjek koji u rukavu ima opravdanje za rusenje putnickog aviona i ubistvo 291 zene, dijeteta i muskarca...Ne dao drag Bog nikome takvo stanje duha i uma...
Jadan ne bio, sve i da su sijali mine, sijali su ih u SVOJE more, NE u americko. Jel poginuo neki civil mozda od tih mina? Sta rade uopce americki ratni brodovi u Perzijskom zalivu? Tako to treba, jelde?
- Challenger__
- Posts: 26509
- Joined: 25/03/2012 09:31
- Location: In weiter Ferne, so nah!
- Contact:
#10275 Re: IRAN
To,to...mousstapha wrote:Upravo o toj kulturi i tradiciji treba vise pricati. Kroz medije se samo provlace politicke teme, pa se tesko probiti.
Političke teme forsira novosvjetski skorojevićki zapad koji se sa kulturom nije sreo ni u prolazu.
