bosnaba wrote:ticoroman wrote:Bosnjaci nisu izmisljena nacija, vec je naziv historijski ustanovljen. Ne mozes u svom tekstu reci "bosnjaci su izmisljena nacija", a onda to ne znati obrazloziti ili argumntovati za to na adekvatan nacin.
bosnjaci jesu historiski naziv , ali bosanski Muslimani iliti od 92 bosnjaci sa onim bosnjacima kralja Tvrtka nemaju nikakve veze, eto zato a ne sto nije postojao naziv bosnjaci
Hoces reci da su se Bosnjaci kralja Tvrtka odselili? Istina ce prije biti drugacija; neki Bosnjaci kralja Tvrtka su sada Bosanski Hrvati, neki su postali pravoslavci i sada su Srbi dok su neki od danasnjih Bosnjaka nekada bili Srbi ili Hrvati. Vjera je mnoge Bosnjake pretvorila u Srbe i Hrvate. I mnoge Srbe i Hrvate u Bosnjake.
Naravno trebale bi detaljne genetske provjere da bi se stvarno znalo sta, ko i gdje ali jedno je sigurno - nema razloga da iko postavi teoriju da su "Tvrtkovi Bosnjaci" nekuda otisli.
Indolentnost "vjerskog i politickog rukovodstva" je bila da tretiraju vjeru kao odrednicu i mnogi nebosnjaci ih vide prvenstveno kroz vjersku pripadnost sto je jednostavno - glupost.
U medjuvremenu pogledaj obavezno kartu rasprostranjenosti gena I1b* koji datira jos od prezivljavanja ledenog doba i koji je znatno manje prisutan u dosljaka na Balkan.
Naravno, mnoge politicke ideje mogu podesavati povijesne nalaze na nacin koji ce ih potvrditi kao validne. To sto Bosnjaci konacno dobijaju slobodu da sebe i svoj jezik svojim imenom ne bi trebalo da bude cudno osim onima koji bi voljeli da ih nema.
Cak i da smo rodjaci sa Srbima bili bi mnogo dalji rodjaci nego sto su to Crnogorci, zar ne?
Jesmo, to smo mi isti oni jos od prije Kulina bana a ti nadji zabavu i posveti zivot dokazivanju da nismo.
Ovo dole je biljezeno na osnovu genetskog materijala, ne na idejama srpskog kriptofasizma. Citaj ako ti nije mrsko i stvori sliku u glavi gdje gene od poslije ledenog doba jos uvijek posjedujemo na istoj lokaciji i kako ti geni postaju bljedji i nestaju van Bosne i Hercegovine. Isti geni koje je nosio Tvrtko i Kulin.
Any two populations will differ from each other to some degree because of the stochastic nature of genetic variation. So, the observation of differences does not mean that the populations are not closely related. To assess how important differences are, we have to put them in the context of intra-European differences. Against the background of European Y-chromosomal diversity,
all Bosnian groups are closely related to each other, more than they are to non-Bosnian groups.
In the PC analysis (Figure 3), the first PC shows that the three populations are genetically extremely close to each other, and closely related to other populations of the Balkans. However, the second PC tends to separate the Croat group not only from both Serbs and Bosniacs, but also from the Croats of Croatia.
The variation at 28 Y-chromosome biallelic markers was analysed in 256 males (90 Croats, 81 Serbs and 85 Bosniacs) from Bosnia-Herzegovina. An important shared feature between the three ethnic groups is the high frequency of the "Palaeolithic" European-specific haplogroup (Hg) I, a likely signature of a Balkan population re-expansion after the Last Glacial Maximum. This haplogroup is almost completely represented by the sub-haplogroup I-P37 whose frequency is, however, higher in the Croats (~71%) than in Bosniacs (~44%) and Serbs (~31%). Other rather frequent haplogroups are E (~15%) and J (~7%), which are considered to have arrived from the Middle East in Neolithic and post-Neolithic times, and R-M17 (~14%), which probably marked several arrivals, at different times, from eastern Eurasia. Hg E, almost exclusively represented by its subclade E-M78, is more common in the Serbs (~20%) than in Bosniacs (~13%) and Croats (~9%), and Hg J, observed in only one Croat, encompasses ~9% of the Serbs and ~12% of the Bosniacs, where it shows its highest diversification. By contrast, Hg R-M17 displays similar frequencies in all three groups. On the whole, the three main groups of Bosnia-Herzegovina, in spite of some quantitative differences, share a large fraction of the same ancient gene pool distinctive for the Balkan area.
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