Optimus Prime wrote:Smrcak15 wrote:
da jasno i cisto kaze se u Kuranu
MI smo moci svojom sazdali nebesa i mi smo njegovi Siritelji.
Radi se samo o jednom od mogucih prevoda, koji je i kao takav toliko neprecizan da u najboljem slucaju moze sluziti samo kao neosnovana spekulacija. Naucno gledano potpuno neupotrebljivo.
nema moguci, nego je samo jedna moguca.
Has a single muslim before 1920 translated it as expanding ?
Yes of course ...
the meaning according to some old Quranic tafsir (the following is the arabic quotes are translated into English):
1- Tafsir muqatel ibn solaiman (year AD 767)
means: we are able to expand it as we want.
تفسير مقاتل بن سليمان/ مقاتل بن سليمان (ت 150 هـ
{ وَإِنَّا لَمُوسِعُونَ } [آية: 47] يعني نحن قادرون على أن نوسعها كما نريد
2- Tafsir Bahr alolum , (year 985)
means: we are able to expand it as we will.
(فسير بحر العلوم/ السمرقندي
{ وَإِنَّا لَمُوسِعُونَ } يعني نحن قادرون على أن نوسعها كما نريد
3- Tafsir alfayruz abadi (year 1414)
means : we we are expanding it as we will.
{ وَإِنَّا لَمُوسِعُونَ } لها ما نشاء
تفسير القرآن/ الفيروز آبادي (ت817
4- Tafsir Alnukat waloyon (year 1058)
means : we are able to make the heaven expanding more that it is already expanded.
تفسير النكت والعيون/ الماوردي (ت 450 ه)
الثاني: لموسعون السماء، قاله ابن زيد.
الثالث: لقادرون على الاتساع بأكثر من اتساع السماء.
5 - Tafsir Alqasemy : (year 1913 )
means: we are able to expand it, more than it is already expanded.
تفسير محاسن التأويل / محمد جمال الدين القاسمي (ت 1332هـ
{ وَإِنَّا لَمُوسِعُونَ } أي: لقادرون على الإيساع، كما أوسعنا بناءها
6- Tafsir Altabarani (year 970)
means :we expand the heaven in every direction.
تفسير التفسير الكبير / للإمام الطبراني (ت 360 ـ)
{ وَإِنَّا لَمُوسِعُونَ }؛ في السَّماء على الأرضِ في كلِّ جهاتٍ
Etc ,etc,etc .......................
[/quote]
Ove si zaboravio:
English Translations of Verse 51:47 prior or around the time of Edwin Hubble's discovery in the 1930's of an expanding universe:
"...With power and skill did We construct the Firmament: for it is We Who create the vastness of space.... " (Surah 51:47). Yusufali
"...We have built the heaven with might, and We it is Who make the vast extent (thereof).... " (Surah 51:47). Pickthal
"...And the heaven, We raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things ample.... " (Surah 51:47). Shakir
Sama cinjenica da se ajeti mogu tumaciti na razne nacine, njih same diskvalificira glede bilo kakve naucne rasprave.
Pogotovo kade se radi o ovako banalnim primjerima.[/quote]
Ove si zaboravio:
English Translations of Verse 51:47 prior or around the time of Edwin Hubble's discovery in the 1930's of an expanding universe:
"...With power and skill did We construct the Firmament: for it is We Who create the vastness of space.... " (Surah 51:47). Yusufali
"...We have built the heaven with might, and We it is Who make the vast extent (thereof).... " (Surah 51:47). Pickthal
"...And the heaven, We raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things ample.... " (Surah 51:47). Shakir
hoces li rijec po rijec da ti prevedem
وَالسَّمَاءَ بَنَيْنَاهَا بِأَيْدٍ وَإِنَّا لَمُوسِعُونَ
Waalssamaa banaynaha biaydin wainna lamoosiAAoona
Waalssamaa - I nebo
banaynaha - smo stvorili
biaydin - sa moci
wainna - i Mi
lamoosiAAoona - smo NJegovi Siritelji
ova dio
Lamusiuna--- dolazi od glagola WAASI'A واسع, sto znaci siriti
kada se doda Mu prije siu, to znaci Siritelj,
naprimjer Hamd znaci zahvala, iz ove rijeci je izvedena rijec Muhammed
kada se doda Mu na Hamd,to jeste Muhammed znaci Onaj koji je hvaljen
tako isto je is sa Musiun, , glagol siriti Vasia, postaje Siritelj Musiun
ako analiziramo ovo
"...With power and skill did We construct the Firmament: for it is We Who create the vastness of space.... " (Surah 51:47). Yusufali
"...We have built the heaven with might, and We it is Who make the vast extent (thereof).... " (Surah 51:47). Pickthal
"...And the heaven, We raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things ample.... " (Surah 51:47). Shakir
nigdje se u tekstu ne spominje sirina prostora the vastness of space
niti se spominje the vast niti ample
I jos nesto da kazem:
DOk god ja imam pristup orginalnom tekstu Kurana i mogu da kontrolisem direktno sta pise ja cu biti deset koraka ispred vas po ovim pitanjima, nece te mi moci parirati sve dok ja imam kontrolu nad orginalnim tekstovima a vi se mozete samo oslanjati na ono sto vam neko preveo (a bogami ima i katastrofalni prevoda)