Letjelice/avioni BiH

[milenko]

Ali je zato EUFOR-ov helikopter sve to mogao uraditi?

Toto nigdje veze!
!

Pa sto nije odradio eufor.

Mogli su vala posat onu Gazleu sto ima Dodik ona je francusko britanska konstrucije.. ima u njoj cesma i za ticijeg mlijeko za elitne planinare koji zalutaju na zelengori. Srbija ima par stotina pilota cija je obuka kostala po 5 miliona dolara pa nek iznajme NATO-u.

jeffersom nigdje veze!

pa eufor je i odradio...ne kontam ovu recenicu...

[jefferson]

Ali je zato EUFOR-ov helikopter sve to mogao uraditi?

Toto nigdje veze!
!

Pa sto nije odradio eufor.

Mogli su vala posat onu Gazleu sto ima Dodik ona je francusko britanska konstrucije.. ima u njoj cesma i za ticijeg mlijeko za elitne planinare koji zalutaju na zelengori. Srbija ima par stotina pilota cija je obuka kostala po 5 miliona dolara pa nek iznajme NATO-u.

jeffersom nigdje veze!

Imam malo problema sa vidom, ali koliko sam vidio EUFOR je to odradio:

Posljednje informacije govore da su uspješno spašene i dovezene helikopterom u Sarajevo.

Ekipa EUFOR-a helikopterom je evakuirala četiri osobe koje su bile zarobljene u snježnoj lavini na planini Zelengora, u rejonu između Čemerna i Orlovačkog jezera, potvrdila je večeras glasnogovornica Centra javne bezbjednosti Istočno Sarajevo Danka Tešić.

Ove osobe prebačene su, precizirala je, u Klinički centar Sarajevo. U ovoj nesreći jedino je lakše povrijeđen Petar Golijanin, kaže glasnogovornica KCUS Biljana Jandrić.

[ljubav_aha]

Toto,zato sma pitala,kako je moguce da vojne snage nemaju nocnu opremu u helikopterima ,jer je EUROFORov helikopterska ekipa uspjesno izvela proces spasavanja

[Rallye180]

Hi there!
I am following your discussion, and its a pleasure to see that people are talking about this subject.
I am a guest in your country, and I am just a hobby pilot.
Seems like BiH is starting to get the feet under itself, with regards to aviation.
In the pre war period, most of these activities were paid for by the government. Aviation clubs were getting support from army, kantons, and the staffing of the functions in the clubs were mainly aviation professionals.
I think the future for BiH airforce, or civil protection aviation in cooperation with the airforce, such as police and border police, will lay in the hands of the politicians.
There are many fine people trying to reinstall the education for mechanics and pilots, there are even more people interested in using these services.
Unfortunately, many of the senior aviators, professors and the necessary infrastructure to make the governmental and regional aviation possible again, are simply preoccupied in other positions, and there has been a gap on educational level.
This leads to less political influence, and even though there are up to date organisations on high level in BiH that will be ready to implement a modern way of handling all administrative legislations and its practical work, there will still take years before this country can say that it offers all infrastructure to new generations that would like to educate themselves within aviation.
It has started, though. Several controllers and admin people are trained here and abroad. Clubs are flying gliders and a few motor planes. Airspace is defined again. Airfields are being better equipped. Systems for keeping aircrafts in the air, such as inspections, are being implemented by JAR, or now EASA, standards around the clubs.
Then its the factor of who will pay for all of the future.
Private airlines and private clubs, thats one side of the future.
Would a private airline pay to have museum objects in their hangars?
Would clubs keep not serviceable planes in their hangars?
Maybe, if the economy allows it.
Economy in most clubs depend on volonteers and on getting more paying members. Flying and non flying.
Its about money and organisation. European General Aviation clubs and businesses claim that the main income for them is actually getting and selling fuel. BiH dont have fuel to sell for GA airplanes, so thats one less source of income. The law makes it even harder to get the 100LL needed.
It should be easier in the future to import it, but then again, if nobody recruits new pilots, then clubs might die out, and we could be left with only army pilots flying, in addition to the professional airlines. Partly or totally owned by other countries...
Well, here is what we can do: word by mouth: talk about aviation in BIH, just like here on forum. Dont forget your old friends, maybe they would like to activate their old skills in aviation, if they knew there are opportunities to hit the skies again. Invite diaspora to the airfield when they visit. Call tourists to come and see your club. Get the media to write about good and bad. After legislation is done, after the administration and organisation is set, then I guess we have to put some more pressure on the educational system, to push aviation back into the universities.
And then, when we are all in pension, then we will see Letjelice / avioni of BiH, taking off with future economic safe landings back here in BiH.
But if we dont talk about it, it will be forgotten.
...and in the end, to make a kid interested in aviation, maybe you could make him or her an airplane of folded paper and show him / her how it flies...

[Toto]

Toto,zato sma pitala,kako je moguce da vojne snage nemaju nocnu opremu u helikopterima ,jer je EUROFORov helikopterska ekipa uspjesno izvela proces spasavanja

a sve je moguce
bitno je da se imaju ljubicaste Gazele za vozanje VIP poguzija

[ljubav_aha]

Hi there!
I am following your discussion

kako citas nase konverzacije koristis li google translate

[ljubav_aha]

Toto,zato sma pitala,kako je moguce da vojne snage nemaju nocnu opremu u helikopterima ,jer je EUROFORov helikopterska ekipa uspjesno izvela proces spasavanja

a sve je moguce
bitno je da se imaju ljubicaste Gazele za vozanje VIP poguzija

drug,znamo svi kakvo je stanje, ali se uvijek sokiramo sa novim vijestima poput ovakvih o spasavanju

[Rallye180]

Hi there!
I am following your discussion

kako citas nase konverzacije koristis li google translate

Nope, I can talk and read your language, but I am not safe enough with grammars... excuse me for using English... and if I am from here? Nope, but been here a long time, a few years...

[ljubav_aha]

dobrodosao i uzivaj

kakva su tvoja iskustva u BiH u vezi avijacije

[jefferson]

Toto,zato sma pitala,kako je moguce da vojne snage nemaju nocnu opremu u helikopterima ,jer je EUROFORov helikopterska ekipa uspjesno izvela proces spasavanja

a sve je moguce
bitno je da se imaju ljubicaste Gazele za vozanje VIP poguzija

drug,znamo svi kakvo je stanje, ali se uvijek sokiramo sa novim vijestima poput ovakvih o spasavanju

hehe, znas internet je cudo jedno:

Isječak iz članka
Remontovani helikop ter Mi8 MTV jučer je svečano prezenti ran u zračnoj bazi u Rajlovcu. Ovo je jedan od pet helikoptera koji je bio na generalnom remontu u Zavodu "Aviakon" u Ukrajini. Predviđen je za izvršavanje tri misije. "Modernizaciju helikoptera uradili smo zbog vježbi u okviru Partnerstva za mir i eventualnog učešća u misijama podrške miru. Za taj dio adaptirali smo kabinu s uređajima za noćno letenje, unaprijedili radionavigacijsku i komunikacijsku opremu koja je kompatibilna s NATO sta...

Evo isjecak iz clanka iz Nezavisnih od 19.02.2008 godine. Ostatak clanka treba kupiti, sto mi naravno ne pada na pamet, ali eto, za potrebe diskusije i ovo je dovoljno!

[ljubav_aha]

jeffersson , znaci : ili nece ili ne znaju

[jefferson]

jeffersson , znaci : ili nece ili ne znaju

Mislim da znaju!
Mislim da hoce (ovo pod uslovom ako se zvijezde poklope, atmosferski pritisak bude normalan, lijep i suncan dan)!
Problem je sto GARANT nisu bili na poslu. Problem je lijenost! Problem je sto ljude nije briga!
I onda mi neko kaze nema boljih ljudi na svijetu. Zlo mi od toga dodje.

[ljubav_aha]

jeffersson , znaci : ili nece ili ne znaju

Mislim da znaju!
Mislim da hoce (ovo pod uslovom ako se zvijezde poklope, atmosferski pritisak bude normalan, lijep i suncan dan)!
Problem je sto GARANT nisu bili na poslu. Problem je lijenost! Problem je sto ljude nije briga!
I onda mi neko kaze nema boljih ljudi na svijetu. Zlo mi od toga dodje.

tako je jefferson

ali su zato doticni iz EUROFORa blagovremeno regovali,ocevidno su dostupni 24/7

deprimirajuce stanje

[jefferson]

jeffersson , znaci : ili nece ili ne znaju

Mislim da znaju!
Mislim da hoce (ovo pod uslovom ako se zvijezde poklope, atmosferski pritisak bude normalan, lijep i suncan dan)!
Problem je sto GARANT nisu bili na poslu. Problem je lijenost! Problem je sto ljude nije briga!
I onda mi neko kaze nema boljih ljudi na svijetu. Zlo mi od toga dodje.

tako je jefferson

ali su zato doticni iz EUROFORa blagovremeno regovali,ocevidno su dostupni 24/7

deprimirajuce stanje

Ma ne. Po uobicjanoj definiciji tipicnog bosanca a i hercegovca, ti koji su spremni 24/7 i odrade posao su krivci za ovo sto nam se desava!
Nije to deprimirajuce stanje, to je stanje za kolektivnu psihijatriju!

[ljubav_aha]

Ma ne. Po uobicjanoj definiciji tipicnog bosanca a i hercegovca, ti koji su spremni 24/7 i odrade posao su krivci za ovo sto nam se desava!
Nije to deprimirajuce stanje, to je stanje za kolektivnu psihijatriju!

znam nije smijesno,ali si odlicno srocio,kao i uvjek

[Toto]

jeffersson , znaci : ili nece ili ne znaju

Mislim da znaju!
Mislim da hoce (ovo pod uslovom ako se zvijezde poklope, atmosferski pritisak bude normalan, lijep i suncan dan)!
Problem je sto GARANT nisu bili na poslu. Problem je lijenost! Problem je sto ljude nije briga!
I onda mi neko kaze nema boljih ljudi na svijetu. Zlo mi od toga dodje.

primaju li piloti platu

[ljubav_aha]

primaju li piloti platu

sto zelis time reci Toto nema plate = nema pomoci

[jefferson]

jeffersson , znaci : ili nece ili ne znaju

Mislim da znaju!
Mislim da hoce (ovo pod uslovom ako se zvijezde poklope, atmosferski pritisak bude normalan, lijep i suncan dan)!
Problem je sto GARANT nisu bili na poslu. Problem je lijenost! Problem je sto ljude nije briga!
I onda mi neko kaze nema boljih ljudi na svijetu. Zlo mi od toga dodje.

primaju li piloti platu

Iz pouzdanih izvora znam da je primaju redovno!
Da li je ta plata dostojna pilota? NE!
Ali, ovo je profesionalna vojska, i ti piloti su izabrali taj poziv, i sve dok nose uniformu moraju da brane i stite suverenitet i uredjenje BiH, kao i da stite i pomazu njene gradjane.
Stoga mislim Toto da ti pitanje nije na mjestu.

[burekodsira]

pitam jednom prilikom prijatelja sa vojnog odjela nadzora zracnog prostora u BL kako je tamo tj sta rade jeli interesantno kaze on meni nesto tipa radari su iz 50ih godina, ostali od JNA i rade jednom mjesecno, preskupi djelovi pa se i ne popravljaju cesto, tako da vecinu vremena provode blenuci u nebesa, nadziruci nebo golim okom

[Toto]

Iz pouzdanih izvora znam da je primaju redovno!
Da li je ta plata dostojna pilota? NE!
Ali, ovo je profesionalna vojska, i ti piloti su izabrali taj poziv, i sve dok nose uniformu moraju da brane i stite suverenitet i uredjenje BiH, kao i da stite i pomazu njene gradjane.
Stoga mislim Toto da ti pitanje nije na mjestu.

haj dobro
moze se pitanje svakako razumjeti
zanas i sam da nije do pilota
da su dobili naredbu da lete oni bi to i uradili
budzet za vojsku je u buli i dobro je sa vojska ima i za plate
ko zna kako su stali sa rezervnim djelovima
nek im fali jedan osigurac moze najnoviji heliopter da bude prizemljen
jebiga: nije helikopter auto pa da ga gurnes sa ceste dok dodje slep sluzba

[jefferson]

Iz pouzdanih izvora znam da je primaju redovno!
Da li je ta plata dostojna pilota? NE!
Ali, ovo je profesionalna vojska, i ti piloti su izabrali taj poziv, i sve dok nose uniformu moraju da brane i stite suverenitet i uredjenje BiH, kao i da stite i pomazu njene gradjane.
Stoga mislim Toto da ti pitanje nije na mjestu.

haj dobro
moze se pitanje svakako razumjeti
zanas i sam da nije do pilota
da su dobili naredbu da lete oni bi to i uradili
budzet za vojsku je u buli i dobro je sa vojska ima i za plate
ko zna kako su stali sa rezervnim djelovima
nek im fali jedan osigurac moze najnoviji heliopter da bude prizemljen
jebiga: nije helikopter auto pa da ga gurnes sa ceste dok dodje slep sluzba

Pa dobro, ti si postavio takvo pitanje, i ja znam da nije do pilota.

Sto se tice osiguraca! Sto su ih koji k... slali na remont??? Bolje je bilo onda sve to rasformirati kako je Dodik predlozio i od tih para auto put sagraditi!

[Toto]

Iz pouzdanih izvora znam da je primaju redovno!
Da li je ta plata dostojna pilota? NE!
Ali, ovo je profesionalna vojska, i ti piloti su izabrali taj poziv, i sve dok nose uniformu moraju da brane i stite suverenitet i uredjenje BiH, kao i da stite i pomazu njene gradjane.
Stoga mislim Toto da ti pitanje nije na mjestu.

haj dobro
moze se pitanje svakako razumjeti
zanas i sam da nije do pilota
da su dobili naredbu da lete oni bi to i uradili
budzet za vojsku je u buli i dobro je sa vojska ima i za plate
ko zna kako su stali sa rezervnim djelovima
nek im fali jedan osigurac moze najnoviji heliopter da bude prizemljen
jebiga: nije helikopter auto pa da ga gurnes sa ceste dok dodje slep sluzba

Pa dobro, ti si postavio takvo pitanje, i ja znam da nije do pilota.

Sto se tice osiguraca! Sto su ih koji k... slali na remont??? Bolje je bilo onda sve to rasformirati kako je Dodik predlozio i od tih para auto put sagraditi!

a koji su k..krasni japanci pravili ovih 10 miliona auta sto su ih sad povukli sa americkog trzista
jos japanci eeeeeee..
eo da su rusi ili srbi iz Crvene ZAstave vec japanci
mogu ovi na remontu vise sjebat spravu neg je prije bila

[keep it real]

Hi there!
I am following your discussion, and its a pleasure to see that people are talking about this subject.
I am a guest in your country, and I am just a hobby pilot.
Seems like BiH is starting to get the feet under itself, with regards to aviation.
In the pre war period, most of these activities were paid for by the government. Aviation clubs were getting support from army, kantons, and the staffing of the functions in the clubs were mainly aviation professionals.
I think the future for BiH airforce, or civil protection aviation in cooperation with the airforce, such as police and border police, will lay in the hands of the politicians.
There are many fine people trying to reinstall the education for mechanics and pilots, there are even more people interested in using these services.
Unfortunately, many of the senior aviators, professors and the necessary infrastructure to make the governmental and regional aviation possible again, are simply preoccupied in other positions, and there has been a gap on educational level.
This leads to less political influence, and even though there are up to date organisations on high level in BiH that will be ready to implement a modern way of handling all administrative legislations and its practical work, there will still take years before this country can say that it offers all infrastructure to new generations that would like to educate themselves within aviation.
It has started, though. Several controllers and admin people are trained here and abroad. Clubs are flying gliders and a few motor planes. Airspace is defined again. Airfields are being better equipped. Systems for keeping aircrafts in the air, such as inspections, are being implemented by JAR, or now EASA, standards around the clubs.
Then its the factor of who will pay for all of the future.
Private airlines and private clubs, thats one side of the future.
Would a private airline pay to have museum objects in their hangars?
Would clubs keep not serviceable planes in their hangars?
Maybe, if the economy allows it.
Economy in most clubs depend on volonteers and on getting more paying members. Flying and non flying.
Its about money and organisation. European General Aviation clubs and businesses claim that the main income for them is actually getting and selling fuel. BiH dont have fuel to sell for GA airplanes, so thats one less source of income. The law makes it even harder to get the 100LL needed.
It should be easier in the future to import it, but then again, if nobody recruits new pilots, then clubs might die out, and we could be left with only army pilots flying, in addition to the professional airlines. Partly or totally owned by other countries...
Well, here is what we can do: word by mouth: talk about aviation in BIH, just like here on forum. Dont forget your old friends, maybe they would like to activate their old skills in aviation, if they knew there are opportunities to hit the skies again. Invite diaspora to the airfield when they visit. Call tourists to come and see your club. Get the media to write about good and bad. After legislation is done, after the administration and organisation is set, then I guess we have to put some more pressure on the educational system, to push aviation back into the universities.
And then, when we are all in pension, then we will see Letjelice / avioni of BiH, taking off with future economic safe landings back here in BiH.
But if we dont talk about it, it will be forgotten.
...and in the end, to make a kid interested in aviation, maybe you could make him or her an airplane of folded paper and show him / her how it flies...

hi Rallye180 ,

its always interesting to get an opinion from an outsider especially like in your case a pilot , to be honest its quite rare . you seem to have some understanding of the problems in this country . please dont take it the wrong way but your theory about the political influence being a major factor in bih aviation is a fair way of the mark . during the dreaded communist times the interest in the aviation was a lot stronger than now . this is significant because a single party (communist) state which practically controlled every aspect of life from indoctrinating/brainwashing kids (they had to swear an oath as "pioniri") to a centrally controlled economy to censored media etc etc allowed the aviation and interest in it to flourish . political influence is a not really significant because the majority of the population is having a hard time barely surviving , majority of bih inhabitants are just above or below poverty line . aviation is quite expensive and complex for a poor population like bosnia . its future is probably in hands of few privileged (read wealthy) individuals , as such i doubt very much that there will be any interest from the general population (sadly).
as far as the air force is concerned i am very skeptical that it will go past a few utility choppers in foreseeable future. it is hard to believe that bih air force can acquire (in next 20 - 30 years) a squadron of fighter aircraft and a couple of transport air planes .

frankly i am envious of your optimism and bright perspective but reality is quite dark for bih , there is no light at the end of the tunnel . at the moment i am in a developed western country and i cant help thinking how far behind we are and the possibility that we will never catch up . aviation seems to be quite a good indicator of the despair and backwardness of the country , sadly today i saw more 747 s in one day than majority will see in a lifetime .

[jutarnji]

Ali je zato EUFOR-ov helikopter sve to mogao uraditi?

Toto nigdje veze!
Ova zemlja hoce u NATO, sutra cemo mi ici nekome pomagati (ma kako god to izgledalo kao naucna fantastika) i neko ce nase pilote pitati da pomognu nekim tamo skijasima. Sta ce nasi reci?

" stas` na Zelengori po ovom kijametu?"

[jefferson]

Ali je zato EUFOR-ov helikopter sve to mogao uraditi?

Toto nigdje veze!
Ova zemlja hoce u NATO, sutra cemo mi ici nekome pomagati (ma kako god to izgledalo kao naucna fantastika) i neko ce nase pilote pitati da pomognu nekim tamo skijasima. Sta ce nasi reci?

" stas` na Zelengori po ovom kijametu?"

Doduse